Chaoslillith wrote - "Using the fact that the Romans persecuted Christians to prove that Christ did exist is a bit silly."

- Tacitus' writings prove the existence of Christians and the fact that they were being tortured and killed by Nero in 67 AD.

Christ was probably crucified between 30 and 33 AD.

The gap? 30 or so years.

I cannot believe that a movement that was growing so quickly (large enough for Nero to feel he had to launch a persecution) was utterly without basis, and that the founder who had supposedly been around just 30 years previous had, in fact, not existed.

Why is this silly?

Chaoslillith wrote ? ?Given that the Romans persecuted the Greeks, the Celts, the British and whoever else they picked that week to conquer.?

- There is a difference between persecuting and conquering. However, the fact that there are records showing that Romans attacked the groups you mention would leave me to believe that those groups actually existed. The same for Christians. I then go from there to say it is reasonable therefore that Christ existed 30 years earlier.

Chaoslillith wrote ? ?Using your train of thought that also proves the existence of the Greek gods, who the Romans stole, the existence of the Celtic Gods and any other deity from that time period.?

- If I was using the persecution as evidence that Christ was God, then you would be right. But I am only showing that it is unreasonable to doubt the existence of a historical Jesus figure. That is what this thread is about ? ?Existence of Christ?.

Chaoslillith wrote ? ?As far as Christ being crucified, so were 1000s of others and I note the distinct lack of literature about them.?

- I don?t understand your point here, but you seem to contribute to my argument. The fact that there is literature about Christ makes him distinct from the 1000s.

Chaoslillith wrote ? ?Just saying Blacknad that there is no real, verifiable proof of Christ's existence. Just as there is no proof of any other deity or Messiah?

- You are conflating two things here. We are simply talking of a historical figure called Jesus and whether he actually existed. We are not debating here whether he is a deity. Sorry Chaos, but from my perspective the atheist desire to deny the existence of Christ is where the atheist steps from sincere doubt to dishonesty.

Regards,

Blacknad.