Originally Posted By: Bill
I then said that at some point in that infinite time a big bang happened. And as time went on the big bang faded back into the quantum nothingness.


And as I said science can show that is wrong at science, that statement is no different to the stance I take if a religious person says the universe is only 6000 years old.

Post 2008 we can show the universe and time are both finite they have to be to start as demanded by the standard model, CDM cosmology and QM.

Those theories and models lead directly back and we can define the initial conditions of the universe

Go back and read T-symmetry article again

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-symmetry

All science approaches now end up in the same position

Quote:

This view, if it remains viable in the light of future cosmological observation, would connect this problem to one of the big open questions beyond the reach of today's physics — the question of initial conditions of the universe.


So science has a defined accepted position as prescribed by all it's main current theories and models that the universe is finite in size and time and with a start conditions and an unknown end condition.

We can even set a time with error on the start 13.798 ± 0.037 billion years ... see the error range that is a scientific statement not an approximation or a guess.

The question of the initial conditions of the universe is outside science and is akin to asking a religious person does GOD have a GOD.

Now you can chose not to accept the standard model and current theories and believe time and the universe are infinite, you can even play word games with infinite, but can you all please stop saying science says any of that because it doesn't.

I have no doubt there may be scientists that don't accept that view as many religious people won't but in science we settle these things by the rule of "put up or shut up".


If you don't like that as a scientist then off you go and overturn the standard model and all the current theories like CDM.

Last edited by Orac; 07/23/13 04:55 AM.

I believe in "Evil, Bad, Ungodly fantasy science and maths", so I am undoubtedly wrong to you.