I would put it like that and as bluntly as that .. I considered making a paper called "Max is right mathematics controls the world and the mathematics is created by GOD" to see if Max got the issue smile

As I have explained the science world is a lot different place post 2008 and some of our own scientists have to be bought kicking and screaming to understanding of what science can now rule in and out.

For example we can now with certainty rule out that the universe we live in is a simulation .. why because of EPR experiments which show local realism is incompatible with the observations.

In your simple laymans terms if EPR is dead and I can't specify the position and velocity of a sub-atomic particle then I can't mathematically predict the exact events at the sub-atomic level except by using a quantum computer which is actually bigger than the quantum simulation and at that point the simulation becomes indistinguishable from reality!

So the very fact we can show EPR is dead and buried means we can't possibly live in a simulation and you therefore must have free will.

If you look at the simulated reality argument

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simulated_reality

=>A decisive refutation of any claim that our reality is computer-simulated would be the discovery of some uncomputable physics, because if reality is doing something that no computer can do, it cannot be a computer simulation.

Science considers we reached that point with the proof that EPR was invalid and hence only a quantum computer bigger than the universe could run such a simulation.

So for people giving up the "solid structured classic universe" may be initially troubling there is a lot more comfort and certainty about what the universe must look like in the scientific answer.

Last edited by Orac; 07/14/13 05:53 PM.

I believe in "Evil, Bad, Ungodly fantasy science and maths", so I am undoubtedly wrong to you.