Thanks for the SOURCE!
Posted by bobbapink on Mar 09, 2002 at 00:04
(207.172.209.190)Re: Heres your SOURCE-Antartic Seas ARE getting Warmer !!!! (Mike Kremer)
I could have opted out right here Bobbapink, and agreed to disagree with you, and left it at that.
I'd never want you to do that Mike. I'm here to learn.
Unfortunately I am as quite convinced as you are not...'
Correct. I'm not willing to leave what i believe to be untrue alone.
That global warming is manmade'
I also believe that man, as a warm-blooded fire-using creature is responsible for some degree of global warming, although I think man’s contribution is insignificant.
and in particular....I believe the seas are warming, imperceptably, (0.01-0.1 of a degree).
Watch now. .01 to .1 degree. Watch that number.
We have not had the technology to map miniscule temp: changes of the sea until v recently.
OK. With what then are you going to compare them? If the error bar previously greatly dwarfed .01 to .1, then the best you can do, now that you have a better means of measurement, is to compare any new measurements with measurements using the same recent means. Trend requires a great deal more than "recent", wouldn’t you agree? But lets continue...
(Re-read Dales excellent find "Terra Measures Sea Surface Temperature With Unprecedented Detail" its about 20 letters above this one
Ok, I’ll be back in a jiff…
Jiff happens!
I’m back, and with this snip from Dale’s post…
Comparing MODIS’ space-based measurements with surface measurements collected from ships and buoys, the MODIS team finds the satellite sensor measures sea surface temperature accurate to within about 0.25°C, which is better than twice the accuracy of previous satellites. Daily global measurements of sea surface temperature (SST) accurate to within half a degree has been a goal of oceanographers for decades.
Alright. This MODIS system is very good, the best we have, accurate to within .25 degrees C. Even .5 degree accuracy has been a goal for decades!
Then, from YOUR post….
These temperature records are systematically warmer than earlier hydrographic temperature measurements from the region, suggesting that mid-depth Southern Ocean temperatures have risen 0.17°C between the 1950s and the 1980s.
What instrument did they use to measure that Mike? If the new and improved and can’t-be-beat satellite system can’t do better than .25, how is it they can claim a rise of .17? Not to mention associating a trend with that rise!?
I’m going to skip ahead a bit with your close…
I had no time yesterday for a reply...today I made time, specially For you bobba, and others?
And I appreciate that Mike. I love the opportunity to look at fresh data regarding a subject I enjoy. Look – I don’t discount that the world might be warming. What I do discount is that
1) man is causing it
2) it is a bad thing
3) man could stop it even if found to be causing it
4) man would benefit more by stopping it than would be harmed even if he could stop it
5) any stop would be more than a very temporary thing.So Mike – I ain’t here to butt heads with you, I’m just here to tell it like I think it is. If I’m wrong, show me and I’ll readily admit it.