Science a GoGo's Home Page Forums General Discussion General Science Discussion Forum why is mercury used in vaccines

OK, let's get back to some science. The level of mercury in vaccines is about .01%.


That is about 20 ppm. That sounds terrible. But then the dose is 0.5 mL. So the total is pretty low. Then let's look at some fish. I did a check. I found a site that lists the mercury levels in various fish. The lowest level I found was .009 ppm and the highest was about 1 (there were a few that were higher, but I'm not a shark eater). So let's say that the average is 0.5 ppm. Then for a 6 ounce (170,000mg) serving of fish we get .085 mg of mercury.

Paul, I hope you have completely given up on eating fish.

Bill Gill

Stimulating comments, Paul. About the question implied in the thread title:

Who first asked, Why is Mercury Used in Vaccines? You? I assume the answer given is:

Because certain science experts say: IT WORKS EFFECTIVELY!

Do we agree that this is so, or not so?
One thing is So though, & not just SO,SO:
We are back on topic, and ready to GO GO!
We also have a verse to show that it is SO!
Now, GO,GO,GO!!!
Paul you say to Orac, Paul, are you sure? Where has Orac ever said to anyone--and certainly not to me--that he "hates all religions"?
You also say to me, My theology (opinion & belief) BTW, is unitheism. Now where is your scientific evidence that I impose my theology, or my interpretation of the Bible on anyone? The Bible, for me, is a document which I study and respect. But unless there is evidence to the contrary, the Bible is not the infallible word of an infallible 'god' theists call 'God'

I repeat: My theology, unitheism, is a collection of my opinions and my beliefs--opinions that inspire me to live, "as one that serves" As Jesus put it in Luke. It is my desire to do good for others into concrete actions.

As a lover of the democratic approach to life, I offer all good ideas, of all the sincere religions, to be part of an open dialogue. I abhor doctrinaire and dogmatic demagoguery which appeals to common prejudice. Therefore, I invite one and all to the dialogue about this at: "Philosophy of Religions--all religions ..."

IN LUKE 22:27, Jesus said, I AM AMONG YOU AS ONE WHO SERVES--the role of a good scientist, eh!
BTW, Paul, allow me to assume that you are a Bible-believing Christian theist, right? If it works for you, makes you a good person and helps you live, "as one who serves", words that Jesus used to describe his mission, go for it!

Question: Can you think of any religion which has never imposed itself, its sacred literature--its Book, Bible, Koran, its teachings and the like, on others?

Bill, I have questions:
in your opinion (IYO), are vaccines safe? And, is the use of mercury in vaccines a MUST?
Who are the experts? Are they worthy of our trust?

The figures on intake of an average adult and baby of mercury I posted above Rev K. If they aren't safe there are a hell of a lot more things that are even more unsafe like eating fish and eating certain vegetables like spinach and they should be banned.

The biggest risk by far from vaccines is adverse reactions to the vaccine itself and hence why it requires rigorous testing.

Those are USA figures the numbers from China are a lot more scary because it estimated by China itself that 25% of it's agriculture land is polluted with heavy metals

Source: https://www.chinafile.com/Almost-One-Fifth-Chinas-Arable-Land-Polluted

A lot of this argument is very American centric .. hey at least it is not guns

That said as was recognized above is they are taking steps to reduce the levels of mercury because this is the latest argument by the anti-vacination nutters. Personally I don't see the point most of these groups have a background issue (religion/anti tech etc) as to why they oppose vaccinations and you will never convince them they will find the next thing to complain about.

For anyone worried about their levels of mercury in their body there is a whole industry in the alternative lifestyle arena built around detox of it out of the body

Unfortunately what many who fall victim to this stuff don't consider is they are simply falling victim to another advertising campaign to buy something they don't really need. I guess it is one up from killing Rhino for the horns to improve your sexual function because at least in general no animals died for these detox "cures".

Personally for adults I support people should have the right to do what they think best and that includes Euthanasia which puts me at odds with many religions. The tricky part comes with children who can't make a choice and and so we get the argument does the parent or the government get to decide for a child?

the below isnt from me , its from the FDA.

Again those were historic not what currently happens and the levels are still well below what many babies in other countries routinely are exposed to.

America has acted by law to meet it's own regulations and those levels are very low by world standards you don't see massive problems in other countries so the risk was very low.

The realty is if you measure how many children die to gun accidents in there own home it would put the risk in sharp context but then the Nation Riflemen Association probably would complain because they are all good guys apparently

The grim story of children and guns in USA is rather grim

http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/he...ticle-1.1592703



I am not sure vaccinations goes anywhere near those numbers or is it's biggest problem, let us at least put all the risks in perspective for children in USA.

Can you give me a link to where the FDA has this posted? I would like to see the original report.

Bill Gill

the link to the page that I quoted is in the first post in this thread.

from what I understand doctors are aware that vaccines that
do not contain thimerosal are available but are still using
the vaccines containing thimerosal because they are still
on the shelf and still available to purchase.

and the FDA wants thimerosal removed as a preservative.

which brings us back to the title of this topic

" why is mercury used in vaccines "

here is some more to read.

http://cerhr.niehs.nih.gov/common/mercury.html

here is the FDA web site

http://www.fda.gov/

here is where big pharma showed its appreciation and gave a
$226,000.00 donation and bought 5000 copies of a senators book.



now don't ask me why you cant find the document if you cant
find it , just ask the $226,000.00 what it did with it.

http://www.thimerosal-litigation.com/

I can't find that quote in the link to the government web page. I did find it in the link to the anti-vaccination web page. That doesn't count as being from the FDA, it counts as an unconfirmed quote. It is not from the FDA as you stated.

The original study which implicated vaccines in autism has been completely refuted and withdrawn.

Bill Gill

I didn't state it , the info on the link did.

maybe they had a dead link because corrupt politics was
able to refute and withdraw the document so they removed
the dead link.

also I couldn't find it either , so I guess that the 1/4 million dollar contribution paid off.

or was it the 5000 copies of the senators book.

anyway its nice to know that big pharma is allowed to consult
with elected officials while they are writing bills that would
protect them from lawsuits that might be pursued by the people
who elected them.

this way big pharma writes the laws that govern big pharma
and they only need to contribute to election funds and buy books for doctors written by senators who also write
the laws in return.



http://www.vaccinationnews.com/DailyNews/December2002/FristsNewSenate24.htm



do you have a link to that info?

or has that info been refuted and withdrawn also?

if it hasn't yet been refuted and withdrawn as you call it
how much of a contribution would it take to get it refuted and withdrawn?

and to which political party should the bribe be addresses to?

I don't see why I am supposed to do all the research on real science while you get by with only using fake science. Do a search and you will find plenty of places where the connection between vaccines and autism have been completely refuted in many studies. Nobody was ever able to duplicate the information in the one study that claimed such a connection. That is one of the major points of scientific research. All experiments must be repeatable and give the same results or it is wrong.

Bill Gill

you did ask me this about what I posted.



then you said this



I would like to read the document that shows that
The original study which implicated vaccines in autism
has been completely refuted and withdrawn.

if its in plenty of places then you should have no problem finding and posting the link.

after all if its not fake science then it must be in there with the real science
somewhere.. maybe it will pop up in a parallel
universe and you can find it with a QM browser.



could I suggest that the 4 million dollars had
something to do with that?

I wonder where the original documents from the original study are located.

Paul, you're the one making the outrageous unscientific claims. So you are the one that needs to prove them.

Bill Gill

I take it that you just made up your claims then
if you cant provide any reference to what you claimed.




if I have made outrageous unscientific claims then would
you be so kind as to point them out to me?

we being myself and the readers of the forum cant just take your word for it , we need some type of
reference material.

that's why I asked you for a link to your claim.

Paul you made a claim that the levels of Mercury where 20-50 times over the FDA levels ... that is a claim to anyone who can read.

Bill has challenged you to show that is so because he can find no reference to that from the FDA .... pretty basic even for you I would have thought.

So it's either an unsubstantiated claim or the evidence of the claim exists.

Personally I don't care all these levels are really low perhaps google what the average level is in Japan in babies and adults.

Ok, I admit I am a wimp, I didn't stand my ground. I went ahead and did some research on the topic.

Here is the Wikipedia article on Adam Wakefield who was the one that made the first claim.

And I'm not going to list a bunch of links that point to refutations of Wakefield's claims. Instead here is a link to the Google search results.

I think that should cover the field. There seem to be a lot of results that completely refute the vaccine autism connection. The first questions were raised when nobody else could repeat Wakefield's works. Since then there has been no reliable study that provides any indication of such a connection. And that is how science works.

And of course according to the Wikipedia article it appears Wakefield deliberately falsified his results.

Bill Gill

You can definitively refute Wakefield go and look at what happened in Japan they stopped the MMR injections in 1993 and the Autism rate continued to spiral upward hitting a new high last year of 1 in 38 children.

AS ONE WHO RESPECTS ALL USEFUL SCIENCE, I ASK,
Has anyone ever asked the following questions:

How safe is it to vaccinate people with very weak immune systems?

Or, what about people who are simply starving for lack of essential, or even basic nutrients?

As far as vaccinating people with very weak immune systems, it would be practical to use a killed virus vaccine and not a live attenuated one. However, the whole point of a person with a weak immune system is that they don't produce normal levels of antibodies, so vaccinating them is probably an exercise in futility, if you think about it.

People who are in a severely deficient nutritional state probably don't have the energy to spare to mount an immune response, but I expect it would have some success.

Wakefield has been refuted, but he got more press than the ones who did the refuting, and so it has gone on and on. Thimerosal or no thimerosal, the autism rate has gone upward at a dizzying rate. As Orac noted, autism is on the rise even in countries that don't use thimerosal-treated vaccines. If it is an environmental thing, there must be more of it in Japan than here in the US. We know so little about autism that it is hard to say definitively that any one thing is a cause.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/for-children-with-autism-brain-abnormalities-may-begin-in-utero/

New evidence suggests that the brains of autistic children have structural differences when compared to the brains of non-autistic children. Research suggests these changes are present by the second or third trimester of pregnancy. It would be hard to show any effect of thimerosal at that stage of development.

From what I was reading it appears that the identical twin studies are actually also showing it is what happens in the womb that matters for those who have the genetic disposition and then the enviromental factors feed into that.

It looks like it is a very complex mechanism and it is as much about the mothers lifestyle as it is the child.