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paul Offline OP
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An IQ test does not measure a persons Intelligence .
An IQ test can only measure a persons Knowledge .

Intelligence is the ability to apply knowledge.

a person can know everything there is to know in the history
of man and still be a bumbling idiot who only houses knowledge
and cant figure out what to do with that knowledge.

which is often displayed by the intelligence of people who have acquired knowledge or who own a piece of paper that claims that they are knowledgeable , as evidenced by the
title of the below link.

http://www.scienceagogo.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=49407#Post49407

so what can truly be said about the many atheist authors of the many articles found on the internet that try to explain
that atheist are more intelligent than the Religious is that atheist authors are knowledgeable , stupid people.

stupid smart people



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Where as some people can't even acquire the knowledge to then use as intelligence to get the piece of paper.

So how does one define them

stupid stupid people?


I believe in "Evil, Bad, Ungodly fantasy science and maths", so I am undoubtedly wrong to you.
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Quote:
Where as some people can't even acquire the knowledge to then use as intelligence to get the piece of paper.


use as intelligence?

intelligence cannot be taught , bought , or given to a person.

from what I have seen so far , you dont need intelligence to get the piece of paper either.

you just need to learn whats in the books.

that gets you the paper , what you do with the paper is your business.


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Sort of like religion then you just learn whats in the book and accept it no questioning allowed smile


I believe in "Evil, Bad, Ungodly fantasy science and maths", so I am undoubtedly wrong to you.
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Originally Posted By: Orac
Sort of like religion then you just learn whats in the book and accept it no questioning allowed smile


Pretty much covers the educational system of most countries.
Mainstream media, and politics.

The system (however it is created and controlled) influences every part of the information highway.

Freedom of speech and press in any country offers the ability to inject fresh material, but those who have the money direct the attention to what is relevant according to the needs of the few rather than the needs of the many.

One thing you can give religion credit for, whether its thru fanaticism or peaceful demonstration, is that morality inspires a few to step forward to speak against half truths and agendas that are specifically designed to put the few, above the many.

Not in favor of the fanatic and any demonstration that threatens innocent lives, nor in favor of the intellectual who knows better and does nothing.

Seems neither religion or science has the morality or sensibility to make changes that aren't for the benefit of their own self worth and institution, when corruption is involved. Regardless of the benefits either offers humanity in idealism, there are few who will renounce their association to belief and or definition of principal to expand humanity beyond the limits of the institution.


I was addicted to the Hokey Pokey, but then I turned myself around!!




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I read this page on Wikipedia the other day

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority

So I can either think I’m normal then I’m not, or I can think I’m special then I’m normal. Either way, I’m facing mental inconsistency.

What does all this mean .... time for a beer of coarse

Peter Woit said that and I didn't reference him does that make me a plagiarist or was it merely a non specific mental oversight. Either way, I’m facing mental inconsistency.

What does this all mean ... time for another beer.


Sorry TT I couldn't be you I would be permanently drunk smile


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Originally Posted By: Orac

Sorry TT I couldn't be you, I would be permanently drunk smile

True, no one else could handle being me. That's why there is only one me.

Some might find it easier immersing themselves into politics, communism, some kind of alternate universe, or habit forming drug to find normalcy. wink


I was addicted to the Hokey Pokey, but then I turned myself around!!




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Originally Posted By: Orac
Sort of like religion then you just learn whats in the book and accept it no questioning allowed smile
ORAC, HAVE YOU CLOSED YOUR MIND TO ALL OPTIONS? For example. How would you label the following? Is it bad religion?
http://progressivechristianity.ca/prc/?page_id=6


G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org
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Quote:
True, no one else could handle being me.


TT, just how do you cope with it?

I tend to start projects because of curiosity and never finish
the projects because of curiosity that happens while Im thinking
about the current project.

if I start thinking about how to solve 1 problem , I get sidetracked by other problems that need solving , I start
with 1 problem and end up with 20 or 30 more problems that
need solving , its like I need others to complete the projects
that I start.

so how do you cope with this , if you also have this problem?

I have concentration issues I think.


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Originally Posted By: paul


TT, just how do you cope with it?

Seriously? How does anyone choose to live their life?

Think about it. Does a person live their life in accord with what one believes is important to the world or to ones self?

Without knowing the interconnectedness of all things, a conflict may arise between the self interest, and the world interest.

If a cell in the body were to believe itself independent and separate from the body it might worry itself to death for fear it would not do its service to uphold the structure of the body, and by default of delusion become self destructive to both.
Unfortunately we are taught as children to fear for our separation, measure ourselves against social standards, and accept self worth as dictated by others and the standard.

If you could step aside from all of that and find your union with all things there is no struggle or conflict.


Originally Posted By: paul

I tend to start projects because of curiosity and never finish
the projects because of curiosity that happens while Im thinking
about the current project.

if I start thinking about how to solve 1 problem , I get sidetracked by other problems that need solving , I start
with 1 problem and end up with 20 or 30 more problems that
need solving , its like I need others to complete the projects
that I start.

so how do you cope with this , if you also have this problem?

I have concentration issues I think.

What is.. a problem?
A river flows through various types of terrain, cutting thru rock and dirt leaving its marked path as it finds the way of least resistance. It naturally finds its way to its destination. The Sea from which all water is stored.

Whether it originated from water that was the rain that was evaporated from the sea or from various springs in the earth all water is connected. It finds its way to various place upon the earth and then finds its way back to the main body on the planet.
All life is similar to this. In whatever direction nature takes it, there is energy, direction, and constructive purpose. Regardless of any theory that anything happens out of random and haphazard occurrences that are chaotic, there is no such thing.

Everything has order.

Finding that order within ones self, one finds their self in the right place at the right time always. Once you step aside of the fear and the stress of worry and doubt, choice becomes less fragmented and self destructive.

I remember a story a man told when asked about the usefulness of meditation.
This man was asked, "When attempting to fix a problem or problems, such as the social problems on this planet, homelessness, hunger or disease, is it wise to preach meditation when the people are not settled in their own mind and body, because of these surface conditions?"
His reply was, "If you teach a hungry man to meditate, he becomes a happy hungry man!"
His continuing discourse was to the effect of enabling the mind, and freeing it from being the victim to circumstance.

There are plenty of testimonials from those who have risen from suffering to become more than the circumstances would support, because of the energy and drive that comes from understanding potential and possibility, and using that as a platform rather than hopelessness and separation from potential and possibility.

Any person can find their way down either road. It just depends on the experience one has of reality.

Where one person finds a problem, another may not.

In a river when water comes to an obstacle, it finds away around it without struggling or fighting with the object in its path. Water can wear away a rock which stands against the flow of water.
The analogy is symbolic of the way we approach life. Man attempts to define and control his surroundings. Often he is the rock standing in the river trying to stop the flow of water coming at him.

If you look at some of the animals in nature and the way they live their life, they follow a different path, in that they are in constant union with the universe.

What it (the universe) is, is relative to how one understands the universe and whether they stand outside of it observing it as an object separate from it, or whether one stands as the universe, in a flow of energy and creativity.

Man is unique above all animals in that he/she can do both. He/she can stand outside and observe the universe as an individual,.. as well as stand inside as universal mind itself, observing all of it's thoughts and creations. Just as a person might observe their own thoughts.
The problem the ego creates is when all power is given to the clothes one wears, nothing is understood of what is inside of the clothes. To some the clothes consist of the clothing, to others its the degree or title, and to the more enlightened, the physical body.

Problems are created by those who do not understand the reality of life.

Questions arise, and when there is no answer the illusion is being cast that there is a problem, when the answer is there but not grasped because the mind is following patterns of the past rather than being seated in the present moment encompassing all that is.

The future and past are constantly being created and re-created. Consciousness is not bound by time. Time is a construct of consciousness and it facilitates experience.

Pick a project, any project and if it's really what you want to work on then there will be no other that gets in the way.

Find yourself in the midst of many projects without a direction and it will be a reflection of a fragmented mind.



I was addicted to the Hokey Pokey, but then I turned myself around!!




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paul Offline OP
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zen?

................,............,.............,............,..................,..............,.............,...........,....................,absorbed.

the next time I feel the urge to ask YOU a question about YOU
I will just google for an answer. LOL

but I understand and I respect your requirements for anonymity.


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You asked and I answered.


I was addicted to the Hokey Pokey, but then I turned myself around!!




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TT

No , you didnt answer!

if you did answer then where in your post is your answer?

Quote:
TT, just how do you cope with it?


can you find an answer to the above question in your below answer?

Quote:
Seriously? How does anyone choose to live their life?

Think about it. Does a person live their life in accord with what one believes is important to the world or to ones self?

Without knowing the interconnectedness of all things, a conflict may arise between the self interest, and the world interest.

If a cell in the body were to believe itself independent and separate from the body it might worry itself to death for fear it would not do its service to uphold the structure of the body, and by default of delusion become self destructive to both.
Unfortunately we are taught as children to fear for our separation, measure ourselves against social standards, and accept self worth as dictated by others and the standard.

If you could step aside from all of that and find your union with all things there is no struggle or conflict.


But I must explain to you how all this mistaken idea of denouncing pleasure and praising pain was born and I will give you a complete account of the system, and expound the actual teachings of the great explorer of the truth, the master-builder of human happiness. No one rejects, dislikes, or avoids pleasure itself, because it is pleasure, but because those who do not know how to pursue pleasure rationally encounter consequences that are extremely painful. Nor again is there anyone who loves or pursues or desires to obtain pain of itself, because it is pain, but because occasionally circumstances occur in which toil and pain can procure him some great pleasure. To take a trivial example, which of us ever undertakes laborious physical exercise, except to obtain some advantage from it? But who has any right to find fault with a man who chooses to enjoy a pleasure that has no annoying consequences, or one who avoids a pain that produces no resultant pleasure?

On the other hand, we denounce with righteous indignation and dislike men who are so beguiled and demoralized by the charms of pleasure of the moment, so blinded by desire, that they cannot foresee the pain and trouble that are bound to ensue; and equal blame belongs to those who fail in their duty through weakness of will, which is the same as saying through shrinking from toil and pain. These cases are perfectly simple and easy to distinguish. In a free hour, when our power of choice is untrammelled and when nothing prevents our being able to do what we like best, every pleasure is to be welcomed and every pain avoided. But in certain circumstances and owing to the claims of duty or the obligations of business it will frequently occur that pleasures have to be repudiated and annoyances accepted. The wise man therefore always holds in these matters to this principle of selection: he rejects pleasures to secure other greater pleasures, or else he endures pains to avoid worse pains.


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Originally Posted By: paul
TT

No , you didnt answer!

Yes I did.

Originally Posted By: paul
if you did answer then where in your post is your answer?


Quote:
TT, just how do you cope with it?



Originally Posted By: TT

....If you could step aside from all of that and find your union with all things there is no struggle or conflict.

Part of it is here, the rest is in what you didn't paste in your reply.






Originally Posted By: paul


But I must explain to you how all this mistaken idea of denouncing pleasure and praising pain was born and I will give you a complete account of the system, and expound the actual teachings of the great explorer of the truth, the master-builder of human happiness.....

The system is not complete. It's a summary without specific detail to arise to the outcome of an expanded intellect.

The system you describe is also subjective. Based on a premise that pleasure is bad, in that it breeds complacency, and pain the contrasting drive to stimulate understanding and learning without getting lost in complacency or habit. It won't get you to Union, it will just sharpen skills of choice. IF choice is made at the level in which problems are created, there is no ability to rise above the problem to see the blind influences that created them.

You can't see the forest for the trees without rising above the forest.


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paul Offline OP
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No , you didnt.

Quote:
TT, just how do you cope with it?


you !

so far all you have posted is advice for others to follow
there is no mention of "how YOU cope with it".

as in YOU.

ie... if I ask someone , how old are you?.

and there reply is , how old are all the trees in the forest?.

would you consider that to be a correct answer to the question or would you consider that to be another question?

you should know by now that I only deal with logic and in order for you to correctly answer the question you will need
to correctly answer the question.

suggesting how others might cope , does not reveal how you cope.

pure logic.















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Sorry I don't follow your logic.

I speak from my own experience.


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paul Offline OP
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it really wasnt important anyway , so I will just accept your
reply as being your answer to my question.

I wasnt wanting to start an argument , I was only
wondering how you cope with being yourself.

and I respect your decision to withhold your personal
information from being displayed on the internet.


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Originally Posted By: paul
it really wasnt important anyway , so I will just accept your
reply as being your answer to my question.

Awfully gracious of you. You're a bit more flexible than the Rev, who insists I answer a question the way he would.
Originally Posted By: paul

I wasnt wanting to start an argument , I was only
wondering how you cope with being yourself.

Had to find out who I am first, in order to initiate a less complicated way of living, than to live by the definition and rules placed upon myself by others.
Originally Posted By: paul

and I respect your decision to withhold your personal
information from being displayed on the internet.

While a person might want to judge me as well as the context of what I post (being that they want everything to fit in their box), there is no fixed definition in personality or occupation that is used in making judgements and comparisons, other than those imagined.
Should be revealing to anyone who is objective enough too see how life is valued by title and lifestyle by most.

Maybe one day there will be a human value movement to destroy the prejudice created by the social and educational systems of the world.

Should open an entirely new paradigm in thought when we aren't taught to believe how life and all that is in the universe, should look.


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a·the·ist (th-st)
n.
One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods.

I am an atheist by that definition, yet much of my values and views are largely dictated by my religion.

Whenever asked about it, I usually respond with: "Oh yes, I have much faith, and I am very religious, but I don't follow the teachings of gods, as I don't believe gods, by our definitions, exist."

Broad generalizations such as this is why stereotypes exist.
Not all Christians are blowhards like the Westboro Baptists.
Not all Muslims are blow up extremists.
And not all atheists are without religion.

Just thought I'd throw my hat in there for a middle ground perspective.

Last edited by Neohippy; 08/26/13 05:29 PM.

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Quote:
One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods.


theres the difference between myself and atheist.

because I do believe in God.
my logic demands that a God Created.
my logic demands that something cannot come from nothing.

my religion has changed from complication to basic belief.

when I say my religion , I say that because my beliefs are at
the base or foundation of most religions in the world , but
do not stray from the base.

God being the foundation.


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