Welcome to
Science a GoGo's
Discussion Forums
Please keep your postings on-topic or they will be moved to a galaxy far, far away.
Your use of this forum indicates your agreement to our terms of use.
So that we remain spam-free, please note that all posts by new users are moderated.


The Forums
General Science Talk        Not-Quite-Science        Climate Change Discussion        Physics Forum        Science Fiction

Who's Online Now
0 members (), 181 guests, and 2 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Posts
Top Posters(30 Days)
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 7 of 16 1 2 5 6 7 8 9 15 16
#33272 01/21/10 02:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
There is no evidence for fakery.
What you call evidence is mostly just misunderstanding of physics.
And in my opinion a moon hoax is way more implausible then a successful project in a long row of other successful projects, step by step increasing in complexity.

Of course: if you see two fallen trees in the woods you could speculate there have been two flying saucers battling each other with some kind of death rays damaging does trees...
Or you could stick with the ordinary explanation: some storm.

Both speculations can explain all he facts, so it will be nearly impossible to prove there have NOT been any aliens.
That's why Ockhams Razor is so important.

.
#33387 02/15/10 04:56 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
R
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
R
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
In the light of the sum total of all evidence, the above is inconsistent with reason, logic and common sense, inviting the ridicule of the rational individual. Such ideation, undoubtedly less conspicuous in pre-scientific cultures, is starkly profiled in the modern world. The U.S., for example, has long been duly acclaimed as a world leader in theoretical science and its practical application in technology - yet, though certainly not alone in spawning conspiracy theorists, it's ironic that so many its citizens seem to live in a kind of twilight zone where large swathes of reality are ignored and rejected in the process of sustaining false beliefs.


"Time is what prevents everything from happening at once" - John Wheeler
#33410 02/18/10 07:28 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,696
M
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
M
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,696
Originally Posted By: FatFreddy
You keep playing dumb about the evidence of a hoax. I guess all I can do is keep posting it to keep it from getting buried to make sure everybody sees it. Here it is again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1UEv2PIzl4
At the 2 minute 35 second mark of the video the flag is still. When the astronaut goes past it, it starts to move.

There's an analysis of that here in this three part series.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zr76qSQ9Z...&playnext=1
-----------------------------------------------------------------ETC---->----------ETC----->--------ETC---->


[quote=Mike Kremer]

Oh Boy....I am afraid I could not wade thru all those pages and pages "Of Fake Moon landings"
Let alone copy them all and clog up SAGGs forum unnessesarily.
Nor is there any point in reading or spending hours looking at YouTube , for non existent dubious answers.
We all know the Astronauts landed on the Moon , leaving Scientific equipment there.

My admiration goes out to Fat Freddy for the superhuman collection he has made on everything he feels is fake about the Moon landings.
I assume that because of the movement of the Flag on an airless Moon Fat Freddy feels that
that particular incident was filmed on the Earth.

Well it hasnt taken me more than ten minutes to spot a few flaws in the Moons moving flag reasoning.
First and importantly...nobody has actually stated what the flag was made from
Was it Cotton Terylene, or Nylon?
The differences affected by static would be substancial.
the pole would have been an insulator...metal , even aluminium would have been considered too heavy in the Lem, where every ounce counted.
Remember that flag was assembled after they landed.
The straight wire was threaded thru the seam along the top of the flag. The flag would have picked up a static charge from their gloves. Being dissimilar materials.

The video talked about the corner bending away from the astronaut as he ran past. That if it was static it would have bent towards the astronaut.
TOTALLY WRONG ...Its more than likely that the first two astronauts, as they stood by the flag for their photo take,
passed their static charge to the (plastic) flag, sitting on its insulated pole. Static attraction or repulsion depends upon the type of static charge on both surfaces.
The third astronaut running by on the other face of the flag...would almost certainly carry the same static charge on his body suit as the first two astronauts.
Meaning that the Moon flag would tend to bend AWAY, before coming back after the charged leaked away, or redistributed itself upon the flags surface. (Which it actually did)

As for the woman rubbing her hair with the blue Balloon.
She did not demonstrate that she had collected a static charge upon that balloon.
she could have stuck it to the wall first to prove that first. Plus her holding the balloon with her two hands only helped any static to leak away quickly.
Her flag was held up by a metal tripod, so that any charged leaked quickly away into the floor.
The top half of her flag was printed or painted in black. the colour or print made with carbon or graphite... that will again quickly leak away any charge that I feel she DID NOT have. therefore this heavy flag did not move.
Nor do you hold a hopefully charged balloon right on the lower corner of a flag. That pointed flag corner again encourages the charge to leak to the floor.
Have you ever played with a balloon, you can make it stick to just about anything.

By the way, for any one interested that USA flag is still up on the moon.

Last edited by Mike Kremer; 02/18/10 04:23 PM. Reason: spelling
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
T
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
T
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
Mike, you and Ready miss the point.

Governments - and particularly the US Government CANNOT BE TRUSTED - and therefore ANYTHING and I mean absolutely ANYTHING you posit against them must be true!

So if we say that cancer is a plot by our government to eradicate humans so their overlords from Dimension Q can take over the planet and despoil our resources, and then if you doubt this, you are either 1) a government plant or 2) just plain gullible.

Now bend over and prepare for assimilation.

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
R
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
R
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
I stand corrected


"Time is what prevents everything from happening at once" - John Wheeler
#33502 03/02/10 10:57 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
Yes, the chinese are the 3rd nation capable of sending people to orbit.

Momos #33510 03/03/10 03:27 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
T
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
T
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
My God! There's a bubble in there! And how do we know it's a bubble? Because some random people on the Internet ASSERTS it's a bubble!

But ... they removed all the others to fake this ... and then they leave in some obvious ones? Why would they do that? Well, because they're not too smart. Smart enough to remove thousands of bubbles except a couple????

Well yea! But how do you know it's a bubble? Because it is!

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,100
K
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
K
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,100
Man this is the longest thread I've ever seen on the internet, 4-5 years!!

But hey I think all the controversy is great. It'll never die but it'll always give people an opportunity to exercise their critical thinking skills. That kind of skepticism is what stops us all being brainwashed like a bunch of Muslims or medievils. It's not so important whether it's right or wrong.

It's a pity people aren't as vocal about the holocaust as the moon landings. That's an event with less hard evidence, greater consequences and blatant government coersion of people's beliefs, along with obvious stated and unstated motives. Nobody'll get arrested for denying the moonlandings or 9/11, but there are poor sods sitting in prison today for making even milder statements about the holocaust.

#33877 04/06/10 05:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
T
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
T
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
There are other reasons they might have closed it out - because despite your belief in your own common sense, you're really not open to plausible explanations.

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
T
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
T
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
How useful is common sense in science?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60uJ7sOx_1A

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
R
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
R
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
Thanks for that, TFF. It illustrates the limits of our ability to form sound practical judgements beyond those that have proven most useful throughout our evolution.

If there's one thing that common sense tells us, it's that common sense is an indispensable asset in surviving the vicissitudes of everyday life. Inevitably, it also plays an elementary ( smile ) part in forming hypotheses. But common sense is not quite science. Thank heavens scientists for applying the scientific method, and mathematicians for their rigour.


"Time is what prevents everything from happening at once" - John Wheeler
#34109 04/28/10 08:21 AM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2
O
OVE Offline
Junior Member
Offline
Junior Member
O
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2
The astronaut's carrying the moon rocks (lunar meteorites) with them, only went up to Medium Earth Orbit (MEO), to the safe zone between the inner and outer Van Allen Belts. Remained there a couple of days, took some pictures of earth, sent a probe to the moon, and then returned safely back home with the moon rocks.



NASA: "The safe zone offers reduced radiation intensities to any potential spacecraft that must fly in the radiation belt region....The safe zone appears as a gap between the inner and outer 'donut,' beginning about 7,000 km (4,350 miles) and ending about 13,000 km (8,110 miles) above the Earth's surface" http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/news/topstory/2006/safe_zone_shift.html

The moon is 385 000 km (240 000 miles) away from Earth.



Picture of Earth from the safe zone.

Last edited by OVE; 04/28/10 08:24 AM.
OVE #34110 04/28/10 10:23 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 48
No problem to pass the Van Allen belt unless you stop there for a week.

http://www.wwheaton.com/waw/mad/mad19.html

A Capsule in MEO would have been detected by the Russians and is inconsistent to the communication system.

Momos #34127 04/28/10 03:42 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2
O
OVE Offline
Junior Member
Offline
Junior Member
O
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2
Originally Posted By: Momos
No problem to pass the Van Allen belt unless you stop there for a week.

http://www.wwheaton.com/waw/mad/mad19.html

A Capsule in MEO would have been detected by the Russians and is inconsistent to the communication system.


It's safe to stop in the safe zone, that's what they did.

Both USA and USSR were bluffing and kept it a secret.

They tracked the decoy probe, that was sent to the moon from the safe zone.

OVE #34128 04/28/10 03:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
T
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
T
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,940
It was safe for Columbus to turn around and go back where he came from, so that's what he did.

#35172 06/26/10 01:14 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 370
P
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
P
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 370
Originally Posted By: FatFreddy

I think it's safe to say that "Bad Astronomy" is a government damage-control site that is not dedicated to truth, but to obfuscate truth.


I have just been reading your experiences with http://www.bautforum.com

What you say about them is exactly true; I have just been through it.

I am amazed that your experience is exactly what I have seen (and not just at bautforum.com).

Given my experience with http://www.bautforum.com, I will give some thought to what you say about the Moon landing. About it being a hoax.

Here is what I tried to post and defend on http://www.bautforum.com


They wouldn't let me post the animations and conducted other insidious, underhanded forms of censorship, while pretending that they never censored anything.

When Worlds Collided.

Heaven and PreEarth were planets, a binary system orbiting the Sun. This happy arrangement continued for countless years, until, some unfortunate circumstance caused Heaven to collide with PreEarth, forming the Earth.

We investigate the evidence that the Earth is the child of such a collision. We show that the planets Heaven and PreEarth were of similar size and mass. We show that many of the Earth's topographical features, such as mountain chains and ocean basins, were created during the collision. We show that certain hard to explain features of the Earth, such as its magnetic field, can now be more easily understood. And, in establishing all this, we uncover a new theory on the origin of the Moon.

Much of PreEarth's crust survived the impact and is today the continental crust of the Earth. Although broken and contorted, giant pieces of the ancient crust acted as ships floating on a newly molten interior, insulating, and protecting, life from the fires below. Heaven itself, together with its crust, if it had one, disappeared into the interior of the PreEarth, never to be seen again. If we put the broken pieces of PreEarth's crust back together, we obtain the following map.



This map is a flat representation of part of a globe. Hence, some distortion is inevitable.....

Read the rest here: http://preearth.net/

The whole idea of the theory is summarized by this animatation:



The impact area was that within the circle.

Pangaea (considered as a land area on PreEarth) was outside the circle.

Heaven was completely submerged into PreEarth (causing massive expansion).

When Pangaea (considered as a land area on PreEarth) is mapped from the sphere of PreEarth to a flat map, you get exactly the map of the first graphic up above. In fact, that is how this map was first produced.

Here is a standard map of Pangaea



The expansion in size of PreEarth after swallowing Heaven, caused Pangaea to spilt apart and break up into what we now call continents.

The circular region where Heaven entered is now called the Pacific Ocean (not all the Pacific, but most of it).

Here is an animation showing how the Atlantic Ocean opened up.



and another showing the opening around Antarctica.



and another showing the opening of the Indian Ocean.



Cool animations, eh?

The author, Kevin Mansfield, is a mathematician (PhD from UNSW) from New Zealand.

From: http://preearth.net/

He has started up a bulletin board at:

http://www.preearth.net/phpBB3/search.php?search_id=newposts

See if there are any topics that interest you?

Last edited by preearth; 06/26/10 01:19 PM.

Earth formed from a collision
www.preearth.net

Plate-tectonics is wrong
www.preearth.net/plate.html
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,100
K
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
K
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,100
Why not just follow the rules of the forum you're posting to?


"Do not use this bulletin board as a vehicle to promote your own website,..."

"... don't embed a huge image (meaning an image that's over 100k or extends beyond the right-hand edge of a typical display) inline using the [IMG] tag but link to it instead."


Personally I do use dialup, and it is painfully slow when I click on a thread that you've posted to, because it seems every one of your posts consistently contains huge images. Even when it's unrelated to the topic.

kallog #35182 06/29/10 12:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,490
E
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
E
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,490
To get back to the topic! Because this is NQS I can reference a TV programme without scorn from the throng--- OK?

I was watching my current favourite TV show last night ( Big Bang Theory) when the group of scientists set up an elaborate system of lasers and measures that used the instruments left behind on the moon to measure how long the message took to bounce back.... AND co-incidentally proving that the equipment left there was in fact still there to be bounced off.

Now I know this show is fictional (mostly!) but I am interested as a non-scientific person to know if this experiment could be performed ---and if so why is there still doubt about the journey, and if not--- what an inventive script writer this show has!

It was a very nice episode, one of the funniest!

Last edited by Ellis; 06/29/10 12:52 AM. Reason: NQR is not NQS!
Ellis #35184 06/29/10 03:51 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
R
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
R
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,840
Originally Posted By: Ellis
I am interested as a non-scientific person to know if this experiment could be performed ---and if so why is there still doubt about the journey...

See: 'What Neil & Buzz Left on the Moon' - http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2004/21jul_llr/

Reason and delusion are incompatible and, sadly, many people are afflicted with delusional disorder.


"Time is what prevents everything from happening at once" - John Wheeler
Ellis #35188 06/29/10 02:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,100
K
Megastar
Offline
Megastar
K
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,100
Originally Posted By: Ellis

instruments left behind on the moon to measure how long the message took to bounce back.... AND co-incidentally proving


They did that on Mythbusters too.

There's doubt about the journey, but there's also belief in a magic invisible man in the sky. The thoughts of the seething masses don't really have any scientific value.

Tho the reflectors on their own don't prove people landed on the moon. They recently found a Russian reflector too, and we know that wasn't put there by astronauts.


Last edited by kallog; 06/29/10 02:59 PM.
Page 7 of 16 1 2 5 6 7 8 9 15 16

Link Copied to Clipboard
Newest Members
debbieevans, bkhj, jackk, Johnmattison, RacerGT
865 Registered Users
Sponsor

Science a GoGo's Home Page | Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Contact UsokÂþ»­¾W
Features | News | Books | Physics | Space | Climate Change | Health | Technology | Natural World

Copyright © 1998 - 2016 Science a GoGo and its licensors. All rights reserved.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5