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#24402 - 12/05/07 03:40 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Ellis]
terrytnewzealand Offline
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Registered: 08/02/06
Posts: 1031
Loc: Whangarei New Zealand
Yes of course we all can do no more than make decisions "based on his/her own opinion, therefore he/she is subjective". Perhaps we should bear this in mind more often.

Very pleased to hear the news about the swearing in. Mind you the cabinel haven't yet proved they "have enough social conscience to run for office and govern the country, creating and upholding the law". Shall we reserve decision?

Congratulations on getting rid of Johny Boy though. As I've written elsewhere today I feel sorry for USA citizens. Looks like the choice will be between Hillary (Bush-lite) and Rudolph (Bush-heavy). We're very lucky to live in this part of the world, but don't tell too many others.

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#24457 - 01/11/08 05:56 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: terrytnewzealand]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
Any one know what happened to the last few pages of this thread?
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24477 - 01/12/08 05:49 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
I found out, from reading Samwik, what happened. This thread had 170,000 clicks. Because of the loss of posts, it now has 80,000 listed.
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24556 - 01/15/08 10:27 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Ellis]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
Ellis comments
Quote:
PSRev: If a religion is defined by connection and social cohesion then atheism, which has none of the above, is definitely NOT a religion.
Ellis, in the spirit of dialogue, I trust that we can agree to disagree, agreeably. In this spirit I offer the following opinion:

First, I am not sure what you mean by, "religion is defined by connection and social cohesion".

I agree that atheism (agodism--a new word I just coined) is not a religion in the usual sense of the word: That is, it is not a belief in God or gods, including physical and man-made things. It is not the worship of a God or gods according to a set of rituals as part of a well-organized and particular system. It is not like the well-organized Jewish, Christian, Moslem, etc., religions.

OTHER FORMS OF RELIGION
=======================
However, my World Book Dictionary says that any matter of conscience can be a religion. As I understand this, this means that if one chooses to live as a hermit and as an atheist, theist, deist, unitheist, whatever, this is his/her form of religion.

BEWARE OF RELIGIONISM, INCLUDING ATHEISM
========================================
My WBD also points out that we need to keep in mind that there is such a thing as "religionism--an excessive inclination toward religion".

THERE IS SUCH A THING AS SICK RELIGION--WAY OF LIVING
=====================================================
I would add that religionism is what leads to so much anti-social behaviour, to bigotry (by-god-tri), fanaticism, jihadism, terrorism, martyrism, etc. All are sick forms of religion, which inspire followers to be intolerant of any differences of opinion.

What about superstition?--irrational religion. Some forms can be harmless and amusing. However, some forms--the kind which inspires you to neglect professional wisdom--can be very harmful.

THE ANTIDOTE TO SICK RELIGION IS NOT: NO RELIGION AT ALL
========================================================
The antidote to a sick religion is to work on developing a healthy one.

The floor is open. Let us dialogue on the questions:
1. What, in your opinion, makes for a healthy and helpful religion, or way of living?
2. What makes for an unhealthy, or harmful, religion?


Edited by Revlgking (01/15/08 10:42 PM)
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#24557 - 01/15/08 10:53 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
my opinion on religion and all belief systems:

faith in unrealistic stories or in an ultimate higher power allows people to escape from the depressing truths of reality giving them a feeling of security in times of turmoil...

so when you poke at someone's religious beliefs you are poking at their insecurities, which explains why you often get a passionate, aggressive response when you express your doubts...

i think that people should avoid arguing with religious folk, because its kind of cruel if you look at it from my perspective...

but it angers me that children are always being brainwashed into adopting ~
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#24566 - 01/16/08 04:54 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: big fat pig]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
I have learned not to debate or argue about many things, including religion. However, I love to dialogue and to learn from others.
============================================================
The following can be sung to Snow Bird, a song made famous by Anne Murray:
=======
FATHER SKY AND MOTHER EARTH--THE SOURCE OF EVERY HUMAN BIRTH
=============================================

We're one with Father Sky and Mother Earth;
With GØD the source of all there is, of every human birth.
We vibrate with the planets 'round the sun;
Within the stars and galaxies, we move in GØD as one.

We love you, GØD, in all there is to see;
At one with cosmos, and with space, and one with gravity.
We love you GØD in all there is to hear,
At one in the eternal now, beyond all guilt and fear.

In GØD we live and move and have our being;
The source of knowledge, wisdom, power and things that are not seen.
The root of justice and eternal peace,
The soil of life, of health and wealth and joys which ne'er need cease.
=====
Chorus:
GØD is at one with all that is;
With earth, and sky, and sea;
GØD is at one with cosmic space,
And all pervasive gravity.


Edited by Revlgking (01/16/08 05:01 AM)

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#24570 - 01/16/08 05:33 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Ellis Offline
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Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Rev: I like these sentiments,especially this line:

We vibrate with the planets 'round the sun; (that's nice)

However I do not understand why it is then necessary to assign all things to GØD (or god for that matter.) Why can't it just BE?


Edited by Ellis (01/16/08 05:34 AM)
Edit Reason: spelling!

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#24594 - 01/18/08 11:05 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Ellis]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
Okay, Ellis, I have no problem with you using "BE".

However, in the spirit of dialogue I ask: How would you go about using 'BE' in everyday language?
================================================================
I LOVE THE VERB 'TO BE', and not TO BE.:)
======================================
BTW, it is my opinion that the verb "to be" is the only verb which I feel comfortable using when I speak of GØD.

For example, I feel comfortable saying: GØD "is" light. However, I do not feel comfortable saying: GØD sends light--as if he is person holding a torch.

More examples: GØD is love (very Biblical, BTW); He does not send us love.

In my opinion, GØD is will. That is, he is not a person who does this that, or the other thing, to us or for us.

Do you get my drift?


Edited by Revlgking (01/18/08 11:17 PM)

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#24595 - 01/18/08 11:09 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
according to modern psychology, consciousness is just a functional state of the brain... no room for god or afterlife or souls or anything....
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#24601 - 01/19/08 03:12 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: big fat pig]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
Yeah! BFP, GØD IS consciousness--the thing which makes us human and thinking persons. Sounds okay to me.

Which reminds me: In Exodus 3:14, where Moses asks GØD: Who are you? the response is: I AM, WHO I AM...

In Hebrew: Jehovah shuah--from which we get the contracted form Joshua, and the Greek form, Jesus--which means "I am is saving us".

It now makes sense that when Jesus said: "I am the way..." He wasn't saying: I "Jesus" am the way..." But: the consciousness in all of us is the way.
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24800 - 02/08/08 08:42 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
WOW!!!!! Over 103,000 clicks on this thread, again. How come so much interest in this topic? Anyone remember what it was before the problem? I recall...was it 170,000?

It would be interesting to know: How many posters here are traditional theists? How many righteous atheists, like Dawkins and Hitchins? Any otherwise? How many are what I call unitheists? Deists? Non-theists, like Buddhism?

BTW, I could coin a new word,like, neotheists. Anyone with a unique concept of "god"? What about agnostics?

Warren Farr are working on
http://unitheist.org/
Check it out and let us know--here, if you will--what you think.


Edited by Revlgking (02/08/08 08:56 PM)
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24900 - 02/19/08 09:53 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
"Yeah! BFP, GØD IS consciousness--the thing which makes us human and thinking persons. Sounds okay to me."

you quote exodus, i quote Einstein:

If this being is omnipotent, then every occurrence, including every human action, every human thought, and every human feeling and aspiration is also His work; how is it possible to think of holding men responsible for their deeds and thoughts before such an almighty Being? In giving out punishment and rewards He would to a certain extent be passing judgment on Himself. How can this be combined with the goodness and righteousness ascribed to Him? [Albert Einstein, Out of My Later Years (New York: Philosophical Library, 1950), p. 27.]
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#24905 - 02/20/08 12:40 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: big fat pig]
Revlgking Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
Before I would dare comment on the quote from Einstein, I would like the context of this quote.

I have the feeling he is being sarcastic. smile
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24929 - 02/21/08 03:37 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
This quote, in a revised form, is from another thread.
Originally Posted By: Ellis
Deiscovery- It is impossible to prove a negative---as Spock would say-- it is illogical.
I agree, Ellis.

In my opinion, trying to prove a negative is also counter productive, uncreative and a waste of time. Spending one's valuable time trying--like Hitchens and Dawkins--to, arrogantly, prove others wrong is certainly not the loving thing to do.

This is why I prefer to dialogue with, rather than debate, others. Debating others just to prove how wrong they are is the devil's game--if there is a (d)evil. It is a zero-sum game, one in which there are too many losers.

LET'S ALWAYS BE ON GUARD REGARDING THE DANGER OF FALSE PRIDE--
the root of much evil, including terrorism.
==============================================
I repeat something I have said beofre: Speaking of (d)evil (Interestingly, "devil" literally means that which splits us, from ourselves and others): We are all quite good at allowing false pride--the root of much evil--take over our thoughts and lives. Evil-based thoughts lead to cruel words and violent actions, family violence, crime, war, and you name it. False pride, or arrogance, provides is the very best kind of spiritual soil--in the negative sense of the word--in which evil can grow.

Therefore, IN THE SPIRIT OF DIALOGUE, I am into affirming the productive and positive things of life. I want to offer readers what I think, feel and know and will help make the world a better place. I want to learn from agnostics and atheists, not judge or condemn them.

For details on what I believe about GOD, my theology, check out the details of this thread.--now well over 110,000 clicks, which was started by Turner, my son.

BTW, both my children are, like my wife and I, unitheists/panentheists. Turner is married to a Muslim, and has three children. He is 49.

Catherine (married to an artist, with two grown children) is 52.
Both my children are well-educated artists and teachers-- Do a search--Wiki/Google--on unitheism/panentheism, and you will discover what we mean by GOD.

The part of GOD that we know, like the air (pneuma) we breathe, is self evident. Jesus told the Samaritan woman: GOD is Pneuma. We get our word 'Spirit' from the Latin translation. It is self evident--no double-blind study necessary--that one cannot live without taking the next breath.

PHILOSOPHY, SCIENCE AND THE ARTS
Using philosophy, the sciences plus technology, the King family explores Nature/GOD; using the arts we apply what we discover to get useful, beautiful and good things done.

BTW, starting from nothing in 1991, my daughter and her artist husband--both GOD-connected people--have built a floating property, including floating gardens (where they grow most of their food), which covers more than a quarter of an acre. They got over half the materials using the the tradeBUX system
http://www.universalbartergroup.com.
The property is now worth well over one million dollars. All the media have given this project excellent coverage.



Edited by Revlgking (02/21/08 03:53 PM)
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24945 - 02/22/08 04:21 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Amaranth Rose II Offline

Superstar

Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 962
Loc: Southeast Nebraska, USA
Rev, I can't get your link to come up. Is it on a limited daily time setup?
_________________________
If you don't care for reality, just wait a while; another will be along shortly. --A Rose


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#24949 - 02/22/08 07:42 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Amaranth Rose II]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
AR, I have tried it too, without success. It was OK a day or two ago.

http://www.universalbartergroup.com

The link may be down for maintenance. I will give them a call and find out.

_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24955 - 02/22/08 09:36 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Revlgking Offline
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Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
A Rose, I just tried it. And it was okay.

BTW, the over-all group is www.barterworld.com

Information regarding first historic transaction from BarterWorld:
CHARITY DONATION CLIENT'S INFORMATION FOR RECEIPT ISSUING FROM
==============================================================
BARTER-WORLD
============
I just got paper-work from Barter World HQ confirming that,
from just two companies, the Family Life Foundation now has available, for spending, $51,500.00 of value in tradeBUX.

As a registered charity, we will issue receipts to the donor companies for the appropriate value, which the two companies will apply to their tax-returns for 2007.

This is a perfect example of how businesses, governments and charities can work together for the good of the whole community.
This is something which the FLF has been advocating since 1973.

RIFKIN, ON THE NEW APPROACH TO ECONOMICS
========================================
In his 1989 book, The End of Work, Jeremy Rifkin strongly advocated bringing the three sectors--business, government and charities--together.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Rifkin

Keep in mind that "Rifkin became one of the first major critics of the nascent biotechnology industry with the 1977 publication of his book, Who Should Play God? His 1995 book, The End of Work, an international best seller, is credited by some with helping shape the current global debate on technology displacement, corporate downsizing and the future of jobs. His 1998 book, The Biotech Century, addresses the many critical issues accompanying the new era of genetic commerce."



Edited by Revlgking (02/22/08 09:40 PM)
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24956 - 02/22/08 10:01 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
Revlgking Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 2311
Loc: markham (Thornhill), Ontario, ...
The Family Life Foundation (FLF) is listed here.
http://www.universalbartergroup.com./charity_workingwithcharity.aspx

Now, with your help, the FLF is ready to inform families what we can all do to help make for better families, better communities, locally and world wide--physically, mentally and spiritually.
_________________________
G~O~D--Now & ForeverIS:Nature, Nurture & PNEUMA-ture, Thanks to Warren Farr&ME AT www.unitheist.org

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#24957 - 02/22/08 11:33 PM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: Revlgking]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
sarcasm? i doubt it:

http://www.celebatheists.com/index.php?title=Albert_Einstein

lots more Einstein quotes of the same context
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#24961 - 02/23/08 01:27 AM Re: Philosophy of Religions--all religions, includ [Re: big fat pig]
Turner Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 16
Both my father, LgKing, and I, like the following:
-------------------------------------------------
Quote:
The religion of the future will be a cosmic religion. The religion which based on experience, which refuses dogmatic. If there's any religion that would cope the scientific needs it will be Buddhism.... [Albert Einstein]

The man who is thoroughly convinced of the universal operation of the law of causation cannot for a moment entertain the idea of a being who interferes in the course of events... He has no use for the religion of fear and equally little for social or moral religion. [Albert Einstein, Ideas and Opinions]

I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals Himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings. [Albert Einstein, in a letter to Rabbi Herbert Goldstein]
Interestingly, Einstein speaks of the value of Buddhism. The great inventor, Nicola Tesla, called for a combination of Christianity and Buddhism.

IMO, they were talking about what my father and I call unitheism
Google on it, and panentheism.



Edited by Turner (02/23/08 01:53 AM)

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