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#25860 - 05/01/08 04:31 AM Humanzee? Ape Human Cross
Mike Kremer Offline

Megastar

Registered: 10/16/04
Posts: 1696
Loc: London UK

Half man, half chimp - should we beware the Apeman's coming?

A LEADING scientist has warned a new species of "Humanzee", created from breeding apes with humans, could become a reality.
In fact producing a Humanzee, an Ape Human hybrid is quite legal.

Although the Human Fertilisation and Embryo Bill prohibits the placement of animal sperm into a woman.
The reverse is not prohibited. In fact its not even mentioned.

Dr Calum MacKellar, director of research at the Scottish Council on Human Bioethics, warned the controversial draft Human Fertilisation and Embryology Bill did not prevent human sperm being inseminated into animals.
He said if a female chimpanzee was inseminated with human sperm the two species would be closely enough related, that a hybrid could be born.

So could a half Man half Chimp, Humanzee breed really be possible?

Yes says Dr MacKellar. He said: "The chromosomal difference between a goat and a sheep, a Shoat is greater than between humans and chimpanzees."

Professor Bob Millar, director of the Medical Research Council Human Reproductive Sciences Unit, based in Edinburgh, agreed. Viable offspring would be possible. He said: "Donkeys can mate with horses and create infertile offspring; maybe that could happen with chimpanzees."

Professor Hugh McLachlan, professor of applied philosophy at Glasgow Caledonian University's School of Law and Applied Sciences, said although the idea was "troublesome", he could see no ethical objections to the creation of Humanzees.
Any species came to be what it is now because of all sorts of interaction in the past," he said.

Dr MacKellar said the resulting Humanzee's could raise ethical dilemmas, such as whether it would be treated as human or animal, and what rights it would have.
If there was a possibility of Humanzees developing a conscience, you would have a difficult dilemma on your hands."

There are a number of other hybrid species that have already been created, using only artificial insemination.
Lions and tigers have been bred to create Ligers, the world's largest cats.
And there are also Zorses (zebra and horse), Wholphins (whale and dolphin), Tigons, (tiger and lion), Lepjags (leopard and jaguar) and Zonkeys, (zebra and donkey).

Most hybrid animals have been bred in captivity, but there are
examples of the process occurring in the wild.
This is far more common in plants than animals, but in April 2006 a hunter in Canada's North-west Territories shot a polar bear whose fur had an orange tint.
Research showed that it had a grizzly bear father, and it became known as a Pizzly.

In 2003, DNA analysis confirmed that five odd-looking felines found in Maine and Minnesota were bobcat-lynx hybrids, dubbed blynxes.

Dr MacKellar said, fascination might be enough of a motive for
scientists to try crossing the two species, to produce a Humanzee.

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/latestnews/Exclusive-Half-man-half-chimp.4028970.jp


_________________________
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.
"You will never find a real Human being - Even in a mirror." ....Mike Kremer.



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#25863 - 05/01/08 11:35 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
i just have one question: WHY?!?
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#25869 - 05/01/08 05:59 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: big fat pig]
Blobby2 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/14/08
Posts: 24

Hi Gogo's our college debating society has decided to hold a debate on this subject toward end of term.
We wonder how humans might treat the the results of a familly of about 4 intelligent humazees. Mother an father and 2 children? Would we use them to help us ? Do you think they might be able to talk with us? Would they make great farmers?
Our monitor suggested that we go and see the film Planet-of-the-Apes

any ideas plus your suggestions are welcome

Thank you Blobby2

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#25875 - 05/02/08 01:38 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Blobby2]
odin1 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/13/08
Posts: 136
Loc: North Carolina, USA
I saw something on "Monster Quest" a few weeks ago about the Russians under Stalin trying to create an "Ape Army" to fight the "Capitalistic Pigs!" They had one lady that volunteered for mother Russia to be impregnated with the Simian sperm. I believe if my memory is correct the Russian scientist was given about $10,000.00 by Stalin for this endeavor. He was never able to impegnate the lady before his funding was cut off. The plan was to have a super army-to mix intelligence with brawn.

However, I believe she did get some flowers from the Ape, and remained friends for quite some time.

I'm serious!
about the proposed ape army
odin1
_________________________
People will forgive you for anything -but being right !
odin1



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#25878 - 05/02/08 04:25 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
Colby S.
Unregistered


I think it would be interesting to see, if the breeding was successful, how the "Humanzee" would develope. If it had the ability of abstract thinking and speaking it could possible learn from us and could, in turn, help us learn from it.

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#25879 - 05/02/08 12:40 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Anonymous]
TheFallibleFiend Offline
Megastar

Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 1940
Loc: http://thefalliblefiend.blogsp...
It's a tossup whether this thread belongs in NQS or the general science thread. I suspect this experiment will be eventually.

It's not clear that humans and chimps are close enough to produce offspring. Interesting experiment, but also highly unethical. Just because we can do something doesn't mean we should.

What do we do with this creature? How do we treat it? Do we stick it in a lab for further testing? How close does a creature have to be to us before we recognize it has rights? Can we do with it whatever we wish?

One thing we might do is start such an experiment in controlled experiment and then abort at N months, if successful. Maybe that would get it out of our collective system. But maybe not.


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#25880 - 05/02/08 03:20 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: TheFallibleFiend]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
i don't think that cross breeding people with animals will expand our understanding of genetics, rather it is just an application of our knowledge. we need not apply our knowledge in places where moral boundaries will/may be crossed.


Edited by big fat pig (05/02/08 03:20 PM)
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#25882 - 05/02/08 05:16 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: odin1]
Mike Kremer Offline

Megastar

Registered: 10/16/04
Posts: 1696
Loc: London UK
Originally Posted By: odin1
I saw something on "Monster Quest" a few weeks ago about the Russians under Stalin trying to create an "Ape Army" ........>The plan was to have a super army-to mix intelligence with brawn.

However, I believe she did get some flowers from the Ape, and remained friends for quite some time.

I'm serious!
about the proposed ape army
odin1


Originally Posted By: Mike Kremer


Well you might be serious, but that idea is more worthy of inclusion in a Comic Strip.....unless of course these Scottish genetic scientists were to produce a Man/Simian Humanzee.

If it was'nt for the fact that it was thought up in Scotland, where the first famous Dolly sheep was cloned,
plus the fact that they make it sound so easy.....impregnation only is required
I would'nt have given it another thought, let alone a mention.
big fat pig, got it exactly right when he asked...WHY?

If it is as easy as they say, I expect some one some where will try and produce a Humanzee.....just because it's possible?
But whether the result is published would very much depend upon the physical, and mental, attributes of this Humanzee.
I cannot see how cross breeding a human with a lesser intelligent ape could result in any benefit to us humans?
What if it were to increase the intellectual capacity of the ape?

Still the possibility of a smooth skinned, white, hairless ape being born would, I suspect give us all convulsions of horror.
Or visa-versa?
Its because we dont know, that some-one will try to find out.


_________________________
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.
"You will never find a real Human being - Even in a mirror." ....Mike Kremer.



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#25883 - 05/02/08 08:35 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hello Mike,

I am joking some, but it's really not funny, you're right these people are serious. I think this fits in with our discussion on
"Science Means Freedom".

It is my opinion that this is ethically wrong and morally wrong.
If I could crack one more joke though. What would Darwin say when he knew after all these millions of years of evolution, some jackleg wants to revert back to Apes?

I agree with you and bfp-Why?

odin1

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#25911 - 05/03/08 09:36 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Anonymous]
odin1 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/13/08
Posts: 136
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Hello all,

read this link.

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/viewnews.php?id=125062

It is an article about "humanzee".

odin1
_________________________
People will forgive you for anything -but being right !
odin1



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#25920 - 05/04/08 01:10 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: odin1]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
I can think of a use for this nasty idea. If chimps and humans proved compatible it could become possible to implant an IVF foetus into a surrogate chimp to gestate. Would this be ethically acceptable? I cannot think of any objection so long as no extra harm would come to the foetus.

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#25921 - 05/04/08 01:19 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Ellis]
odin1 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/13/08
Posts: 136
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Hello everyone,

I guote Colby S.

"I think it would be interesting to see, if the breeding was successful, how the "Humanzee" would develope. If it had the ability of abstract thinking and speaking it could possible learn from us and could, in turn, help us learn from it."

I was told that Einstein recieved a letter from a woman, I don't know who she was but she offered to have a child with him for the purpose of an offspring that had her looks and his brains.
As the story goes he wrote her back and said that sounded nice but suppose the child had her brains and his looks!

Maybe, something to consider about humanzees.

best regards,
odin1
_________________________
People will forgive you for anything -but being right !
odin1



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#25944 - 05/04/08 11:59 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: odin1]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
They would be an exploitable underclass. An irresistible thought for some I think.

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#25946 - 05/05/08 12:33 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Ellis]
big fat pig Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 97
ellis, that would be horrible haha, imagine telling your son/daughter that they were born by an ape, it would be traumatic.
_________________________
seize the day

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#26011 - 05/10/08 06:43 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: big fat pig]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
What would be the legal position of such a chimera? Is it/he/she a human or an animal?

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#26874 - 06/25/08 10:40 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Ellis]
Mike Kremer Offline

Megastar

Registered: 10/16/04
Posts: 1696
Loc: London UK
Originally Posted By: Ellis
They would be an exploitable underclass. An irresistible thought for some I think.


Originally Posted By: Mike Kremer


Or at least a class between Humans and Apes.?

I thought the following item deserves a mention within these postings?
"Spanish Parliament to Extend Human Rights to Apes"

http://uk.reuters.com/article/scienceNews/idUKL256586320080625


_________________________
.

.
"You will never find a real Human being - Even in a mirror." ....Mike Kremer.



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#26875 - 06/26/08 03:14 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
Anonymous
Unregistered


The theather play "Zoo" by Peter Shaefer (I think anyways.. same author who wrote "Equus") explores this topic. Was written decades ago.

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#29012 - 01/03/09 02:28 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
Mike Kremer Offline

Megastar

Registered: 10/16/04
Posts: 1696
Loc: London UK
Originally Posted By: Mike Kremer
Originally Posted By: Ellis
They would be an exploitable underclass. An irresistible thought for some I think.


Originally Posted By: Mike Kremer


Or at least a class between Humans and Apes.?

I thought the following item deserves a mention within these postings?
"Spanish Parliament to Extend Human Rights to Apes"

http://uk.reuters.com/article/scienceNews/idUKL256586320080625



[quote=Mike Kremer]
Here is an addition to this interesting post.
With the thoughts of RICHARD DAWKINS posted 2nd Jan: 2009.

"How would you feel about a half-human half-chimp hybrid?"

Dawkins speculates about how a human-chimp hybrid or the discovery of a living Homo erectus would change the way we see the World.
......>2. A successful hybridisation between a human and a chimpanzee. Even if the hybrid were infertile like a mule, the shock waves that would be sent through society would be salutary. This is why a distinguished biologist described this possibility as the most immoral scientific experiment he could imagine: it would change everything! It cannot be ruled out as impossible, but it would be surprising.

***My thoughts
As I wrote previously.....It may be immoral, ...but a Ape/Human chimera, is quite legal.
More of Richard Dawkins thoughts below.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/blog/2009/jan/02/richard-dawkins-chimpanzee-hybrid

_________________________
.

.
"You will never find a real Human being - Even in a mirror." ....Mike Kremer.



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#29015 - 01/03/09 04:23 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
Iztaci Offline
Member

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 84
Loc: Rocky Mt. West
I can't imagine a greater waste of time than to debate the morality of such a program. History makes it more than plain that morality never has any ultimate say in such things at all. Just a few years ago "moral outrage" would have seemed to cancel any chance of even cloning a sheep. So... we'll have the usual noise and clamor but in the background, in some state-of-the-art lab, we'll be experimenting on a human/chimp cross. I'd have a hard time imagining it not going on right now. And I'd have a hard time thinking it won't be done.

People sling the word "morality" around as if it were something graven into a marble tablet on some mountain top somewhere just waiting for a prophet to retrieve for the masses. Truth be considered, there is nothing even approaching a consensus on the matter. There are as many "moralities" in the world as there are people. The word is about as definitive as the term “common sense”. In other words, a thing be moral if it agrees with your ideas of right and wrong. If it does not, it is , of course, “immoral”.

Paraphrasing what Einstein said of Ccommon Sense: “It’s the prejudice one accumulates before the age of eighteen.”.

Oh yeah, there will be plenty of noise. Lawyers will get rich. Labs may be bombed. The word pontification may have to be redefined.

And… maybe, just maybe, the ultimate insult to an otherwise useful system of generic nomenclature; "Homo Sapiens Sapiens" will be gut-shot and replaced with a less egotistical term.

_________________________
When you talk to me like I'm five, I want to write on you with a crayon. -- Joanna Hoffman

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#29037 - 01/05/09 04:44 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Iztaci]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Whilst I agree with you that 'morality' is in the eye of the beholder I nonetheless feel that within the creation of a human-chimp (or other ape) chimera there is an underlying question regarding the morality of doing so. The aim of such an endeavour seems very suspect. The resultant cross would be likely to be stronger than a human in many aspects, but likely to be less intelligent. The uses that such a class of hybrids could be used for would be limited but open to horrific exploitation. As I mentioned earlier, such selection would produce a group ideal as a slave class, not only as servants but also as soldiers.

It seems to me that the immorality of this idea would be more in the fact that the result of this exploitaton had been anticipated and we had done nothing about it, rather than the act itself.


Edited by Ellis (01/05/09 04:47 AM)
Edit Reason: Spelling--more of a typo really

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#29040 - 01/05/09 05:52 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Ellis]
Iztaci Offline
Member

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 84
Loc: Rocky Mt. West
Originally Posted By: Ellis
Whilst I agree with you that 'morality' is in the eye of the beholder I nonetheless feel that within the creation of a human-chimp (or other ape) chimera there is an underlying question regarding the morality of doing so. The aim of such an endeavour seems very suspect. The resultant cross would be likely to be stronger than a human in many aspects, but likely to be less intelligent. The uses that such a class of hybrids could be used for would be limited but open to horrific exploitation. As I mentioned earlier, such selection would produce a group ideal as a slave class, not only as servants but also as soldiers. .

It seems to me that the immorality of this idea would be more in the fact that the result of this exploitaton had been anticipated and we had done nothing about it, rather than the act itself.


Your point is well taken. I think you have nailed the likely consequences to the proverbial wall. But, that is not my agrument. You've answered my arguments with a bunch of stuff I already agree with.

The idea of a crossing of primate DNA is not attractive to me at all. But I'm not interested in the myriad opinions on that. I'm interested in what will happen whether I like it or not.

I think a moral argument is about as likely to change anything as a Papal admonition. People show up by the millions to hear him tell them not to bag thier best friend's old lady. Not to spank the pup. Not to lie. Not to cheat the market, not to cap the guy that's pissing you off, and so on and so on and so on.... We've been attending Papal admonitions for centuries and thus far, very few, (very, very few), have ever given them a moment's thought let alone try to live in accordance with them. Everyone cheers and applaudes the Pope. Then they head out to a party where anything goes.

Quote:
It seems to me that the immorality of this idea would be more in the fact that the result of this exploitaton had been anticipated and we had done nothing about it, rather than the act itself.


Okay! Let's see if we can solve something here. I agree. We are going to wake up some morning and realize we ain't done squat. So... what exactly do we, the great unwashed masses, DO about it? Write a letter to Gov. Blagojavitch? Start a grass-roots rebellion? Petition the Pope? Donate to Saddleback Church? Let's have it. I'm all ears. I've read your posts and believe you to be sincere and level-headed. Tell me what you propose and I may just jump aboard.

And that is my argument. Not whether you and I like what's going on.

_________________________
When you talk to me like I'm five, I want to write on you with a crayon. -- Joanna Hoffman

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#29056 - 01/06/09 12:45 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Iztaci]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Left to its own devices my cynicism will give yours a run for its money. I cannot suggest prayer or religion as I don't think there's ever been anyone listening. By now he, she or it should have done something about it! I can't suggest lobbying politicians because we all know how that ends up, and unless we ordinary people can see something in it for ourselves we are not going to want to change anything. So that's a bit depressing!!

However now and again public distaste and pressure can do good. Examples of disinterested good are very hard to find but arguably could include-- the result in South Africa, Ghandi's predominantly peaceful demonstrations regarding independence, and more recently in my country an apology was made to the aboriginal people for the behaviour of the colonising Europeans who took over their country (whilst this may seem paltry it is a first step to better times) . Do not forget that the use of poison gas is forbidden, that use of nuclear weapons has happened only twice in 60 years and slavery is illegal in all countries. OK there's lots wrong, after all I am writing this with dreadful news coming from the Middle East, but some things are improving. Most of us desire the same thing,-- a home, a family, friends enough money to support orselves and some happiness along the way. It's basic and it's what most of us want.

Since we are such simple creatures it should be possible to sometimes make decisions which are in the public good. This would be one of them... ie no manufacturing of beings to be slaves or live bodies for experimentation. However I do share your fear (but maybe not your conviction) that such research will prove irresistible for some. This raises the question--- should there be a limit to the suitability of some subjects for such research? We condemn Dr Mengele, but his research in some areas was still used to advance knowledge, and save lives. Now there's a dilemma!

Meanwhile I guess we have to try a bit harder! And have the courage to go for change when it is needed. As humans that is hard to do. We all like the familiar and comfortable and need a shake up from time to time.

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#29058 - 01/06/09 04:15 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Ellis]
Iztaci Offline
Member

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 84
Loc: Rocky Mt. West
Originally Posted By: Ellis
Left to its own devices my cynicism will give yours a run for its money. I cannot suggest prayer or religion as I don't think there's ever been anyone listening. By now he, she or it should have done something about it! I can't suggest lobbying politicians because we all know how that ends up, and unless we ordinary people can see something in it for ourselves we are not going to want to change anything. So that's a bit depressing!!

However now and again public distaste and pressure can do good. Examples of disinterested good are very hard to find but arguably could include-- the result in South Africa, Ghandi's predominantly peaceful demonstrations regarding independence, and more recently in my country an apology was made to the aboriginal people for the behaviour of the colonising Europeans who took over their country (whilst this may seem paltry it is a first step to better times) . Do not forget that the use of poison gas is forbidden, that use of nuclear weapons has happened only twice in 60 years and slavery is illegal in all countries. OK there's lots wrong, after all I am writing this with dreadful news coming from the Middle East, but some things are improving. Most of us desire the same thing,-- a home, a family, friends enough money to support orselves and some happiness along the way. It's basic and it's what most of us want.

Since we are such simple creatures it should be possible to sometimes make decisions which are in the public good. This would be one of them... ie no manufacturing of beings to be slaves or live bodies for experimentation. However I do share your fear (but maybe not your conviction) that such research will prove irresistible for some. This raises the question--- should there be a limit to the suitability of some subjects for such research? We condemn Dr Mengele, but his research in some areas was still used to advance knowledge, and save lives. Now there's a dilemma!

Meanwhile I guess we have to try a bit harder! And have the courage to go for change when it is needed. As humans that is hard to do. We all like the familiar and comfortable and need a shake up from time to time.


1. Asst, coach to coach, timidly, at basketball game:

“Gee coach, we’re behind 42 to 115, our top 4 players are benched for fouls and there’s only 3 minutes left in the game. I think we may lose this one.”

Coach, purple-faced and shouting:

“Shut up with your *^&*^%$% cynicism! You’re going to demoralize the players with all that negative blabber!”

Cynicism, you say ? Why do some people who obviously don’t like reality call it cynicism?

2. An apology by people who weren’t even born when the travesty began, to people who have been dead for decades. Seems paltry? Nah… I don’t think so. It’s so far beyond paltry it gives new meaning to the word absurdity. There are things like this going on here in the US too. And every few days Bush and other heads of state issue a “strong condemnation” on some rogue action by some rogue state or other. How many of them can remember who they condemned and for what an hour later?

3. “Since we are such simple creatures it should be possible to sometimes make decisions which are in the public good.”
Once again, we get to “we should”. I’ve already agreed with a dozen of your we shoulds. I agree with this one too. But I’d much rather see some “we cans” I can’t think of any. I’m looking for someone who can. My whole original post was a statement to that effect. “it should be possible”? Okay, I agree. Now, HOW? What good is a should without a how? Or even an idea of a how? I keep asking how… and you keep answering we should.

Are we going anywhere with this, Ellis. Or am I just cynical for asking?


Edited by Iztaci (01/06/09 04:18 AM)
_________________________
When you talk to me like I'm five, I want to write on you with a crayon. -- Joanna Hoffman

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#29059 - 01/06/09 04:57 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Iztaci]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Perhaps we could kill an Archduke and start a war? Or fire tonnes of rockets on 'sitting-duck' children just because we can?

I don't think we can get very far as individuals, but if we were to work together the force of the people would be a mighty one. It has worked before and it could work again!

So I think you have argued me into a corner. Deep down I do feel that humans can make the choice for development and progress that tries not to disadvantage others, but I think you are probably right, my argument is going nowhere. Nowhere short of revolution that is!!

PS The Apology here was very much sought after by the present day descendents of the original dispossessed aboriginals. Don't forget this all happened relatively recently for eg. children of mixed ancestory were removed from their parents in the 1970's in this country, to be adopted by white families. Some are still alive today as are their families. Hopefully Sorry Day will be just a start.


Edited by Ellis (01/06/09 05:00 AM)
Edit Reason: Change 'should' to 'could'!

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#29060 - 01/06/09 08:08 AM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Ellis]
Iztaci Offline
Member

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 84
Loc: Rocky Mt. West
I guess I downplayed the Australian situation a bit. Our situation is a whole lot sillier. Sure, we stole this country and slaughtered the natives. But how realistic is it to suggest we give it back? I hope your Sorry Day does some good. As for us here in America, we should be apologizing for Barry Manilow and Hummers. Things we could actually get rid of. Things that make the rest of the world hate us. And rightfully so.

Well, maybe I did argue you into a corner but remember that I was already in that corner. Clueless. Just waiting for someone to come along and clue me in. I do, however, have to poke around a bit and look under some rocks before I sign on to any new idea. I guess that could be called cynical, but it seems that when I neglected to do that, I wound up eating a lot of tofu and parsly soup.

If you ever do come up with something exciting, let me know. I've been poking around for fifty or so years and I'm ready for something a little less violent than what I've seen so far. I might not be able to light the fire but I could throw some sticks on it.

Regards.
_________________________
When you talk to me like I'm five, I want to write on you with a crayon. -- Joanna Hoffman

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#29346 - 02/03/09 08:54 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: Mike Kremer]
awalshe09 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/03/09
Posts: 3
If there was a possibility of Humanzees developing a conscience, you would have a difficult dilemma on your hands."

First off, many animals have shown have a conscience, and who has ever cared about their treatment? Chimpanzees have the same intelligence level as some Down syndrome child, more than some DSC in fact. Chimpanzees are able to communicate, they can be taught sign language, they show remorse, happiness, humor, grief and anger. What is conciseness?

Is it possible, I doubt it, or some so called Scientist without a conscience would have already done it.
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#29353 - 02/04/09 02:20 PM Re: Humanzee? Ape Human Cross [Re: awalshe09]
TheFallibleFiend Offline
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Registered: 06/08/05
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"Is it possible, I doubt it, or some so called Scientist without a conscience would have already done it."

Maybe. Or, it could be that such a scientist would worry that if he did it, his career might be over.

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