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Originally Posted By: terrytnewzealand
Rallem wrote:

"the President did warn us this would be a long and difficult course". I'm sure I saw him ages ago declaring the US had won it.

Coberst wrote:

"Rallem pointed out just how few soldiers were killed in this Iraq war as compared to other wars."

Yes, but plenty of civilians or do they not count? That was actually the point of my last post. The US admin can afford to keep this war going indefinitely.


You saw the president announce that we won that phase of the war, not the war, and no the civilians don't count. Those people over there have been murdering each other whole sale for so long that I don't they understand that there could be another life. Personally I feel the mistake we made was being kind to these people. Perhaps we should have flattened the country and told them that if we didn't see any improvement in their behavior then we would be back the following year.

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Rallem wrote:

"the mistake we made was being kind to these people".

Ahem. I shudder to imagine what would happen if you were being unkind.

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Rallem- Rallem---These are all people. With wives, with husbands, with children,--they are children, are civilians, are soldiers.

What on earth happened to you that you can write as you do? These dead people were important--- as important as you or me. Their deaths have diminished us all.

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It isn't Americans who are killing these people. It wasn't before the war, it isn't during the war, and after we leave those people will still keep killing each other because that is how they live.

The people in the Middle East have a saying, my brothers and I against my cousins, and my cousins and I against the world. When we went into this war the russians gave us one piece of advice, which was that these people only understand one thing and that is brute force. [sic] I know it sounds cold but it is an undeniable truth.

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There are more people being killed now each day than ever were under the brutal dictator Saddam Hussein. But I suppose because it is a result of the US effort to collar resources that's alright.

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Rallem--You are using the RUSSIAN code of behaviour as an excuse for Americans????

How sad.

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Originally Posted By: terrytnewzealand
There are more people being killed now each day than ever were under the brutal dictator Saddam Hussein. But I suppose because it is a result of the US effort to collar resources that's alright.


Firstly, it cannot truely be said that there are more people being killed today in Iraq then before the beginning of the war Terry, because unmarked mass burial sites are regularly being discovered and the numbers of unreported deaths is staggering. Secondly,show me some evidence that the United States of America has received any oil disporportional to others since the start of the war. I see leftist articles of proposed laws in Iraq saying the United States is forcing the break up of national oil monopoly, but I don't see anything about America consuming their oil.

Originally Posted By: Ellis
Rallem--You are using the RUSSIAN code of behaviour as an excuse for Americans????

How sad.


No I am not. Where did you get this idea from, the fact that I said russia gave us advice before the war?

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Rallem wrote:

"I don't see anything about America consuming their oil'.

No, but the oil companies are doing very well thank you. The US taxpayer is funding their effort to control the flow. The US admin also seems keen to prevent western oil and nuclear technology companies being exposed to any potential competition from Iran. When will we see Colin Powell telling the world about Iran's weapons of mass destruction?

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Terry, your views against the American foreign diplomatic platform are obviously vehement but also very out dated.

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Quoting Rallem

The people in the Middle East have a saying, my brothers and I against my cousins, and my cousins and I against the world. When we went into this war the russians gave us one piece of advice, which was that these people only understand one thing and that is brute force. [sic] I know it sounds cold but it is an undeniable truth.

So I assumed that the influence of the Russian code of conduct, ie the adoption of brute force, was being referred to in an admiring manner.

But apparently not so, as Rallem replied:

No I am not. Where did you get this idea from, the fact that I said russia gave us advice before the war?

I suggest that I got the idea from your post-- which on a second reading refers to this point of view as "cold, but (it is) an undeniable truth." I repeat that following the Russian code of conduct is something I had not thought would ever be embraced by Americans as an "undeniable truth"! I still feel it's sad as it diminishes the perceived morality of the American cause.

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Rallem wrote:

"your views against the American foreign diplomatic platform are ... very out dated".

Outdated? What has changed recently?

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The "outdated" bit is probably that you, terry, like me, had not realised that American foreign diplomatic poicy was all a part of a cunning plan developed by the Russians!

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This thread is actually about journalism so I'll mention here that I think the greatest dis-service journalists have committed against the citizens of the USA and Britain is the failure to force an answer as to why their leaders lied so vehemently to convince everyone they should support an invasion of Iraq.

I seem to remember one journalist did try to get George W to say exactly why but she is now banned from presidential press conferences. In the absence of a convincing reason we can only presume the reason George Bush invaded Iraq was the same as the reason Julius Caesar invaded Gaul: personal financial gain.

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Or just because it was there!! (And so was all that lovely oil!!!)

Journalists have little to be proud of regarding the reporting of the Iraq war. Do you remember the glee with which the 'embedded' journalists reported their sanitised war stories during those first days of invasion? There was no independent or unbiased reporting there.

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