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#21005 - 04/27/07 08:24 PM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Ellis]
samwik Offline
Megastar

Registered: 10/10/06
Posts: 1164
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: Ellis
Sorry- can't do the blue link thing but in the Melbourne Age this morning a new theory on this topic---Fungus!

Nosema ceranae no less. It has been found in dead bees and in the hives as well as 2 other fungi and half a dozen viruses. The phenomenom is being described as Colony Collapse Disorder! and the researcher says he is not sure that this latest fungus is THE culprit or not. There have been losses in England and Canada and a quarter of the 2.4 milion colonies in the US.


Well done Mike---admirable theory! Unfortunately only too plausible.




Y'know, I've got a backyard carpeted with yellow dandelion flowers (sorry suburbia), and it is silent.

There are no bees to be seen.

There are some bird sounds, but no activity; that carpet would normally be undulating with bees.

A Quiet Spring.

Yikes?

~samwik

p.s. Is anyone seeing normal bee numbers? Paucities?


Edited by samwik (04/27/07 08:50 PM)
_________________________
Pyrolysis creates reduced carbon! ...Time for the next step in our evolutionary symbiosis with fire.

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#21020 - 04/28/07 01:16 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: samwik]
Wolfman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/17/06
Posts: 264
Loc: Pago Pago, American Samoa
Samwik, your post reminded me of when I was living in Canada. April 23rd is St' George's Day, and is considered, by certain enthusiasts, as the best day of the year to pick Dandelions for wine-making. I'd batch about 40 Gallons every Spring. It was a HUGE hit the following Christmas, and I got dozens of requests to supply weddings.
And, yes, the Bees would be out in hordes on St. George's Day.

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#21026 - 04/28/07 03:31 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Wolfman]
Mike Kremer Offline

Megastar

Registered: 10/16/04
Posts: 1696
Loc: London UK
Originally Posted By: Wolfman
Samwik, your post reminded me of when I was living in Canada..........................


Hehehe.
Hi Wolfman, your post reminded me of when I was living in Canada.
It was illegal to distil a potent brew.
So I invented us a brew that that had a bigger effect upon the brain than liquor.
Mash up some fresh field mushrooms, add water plus sugar, plus ONE multi-vitamin tab per gallon jar.
It would blow our heads off.
Never had the courage to try it again since.

Mike Kremer
_________________________
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.
"You will never find a real Human being - Even in a mirror." ....Mike Kremer.



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#21030 - 04/28/07 06:53 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Mike Kremer]
samwik Offline
Megastar

Registered: 10/10/06
Posts: 1164
Loc: Colorado
Hiya Mike,
Hey, I ref.'d your physics post in my last response on the GW forum 'survey' thread.

I've got some year old homemade pesto in the fridge that'd probably do the same thing as your 'shroom juice. smile We've grown some wicked apple cider and grape cider in our fridge too.

Hey, I did see about 5 bees late this afternoon, but...will keep posting.

Did anyone see my post at end of first page about Toxoplasmosis (a cat disease) also infects mice brains, causing mice to loose their fear of cats, thus completing the cycle. I learned that a few months ago and I still think it's amazing. Is that common knowledge? I think it's an amazing example of evolution at work.

Again, I was thinking about how some disease could change bee behavior. CCD would sure help disseminate the disease.

~samwik
_________________________
Pyrolysis creates reduced carbon! ...Time for the next step in our evolutionary symbiosis with fire.

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#21036 - 04/28/07 09:16 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: samwik]
terrytnewzealand Offline
Megastar

Registered: 08/02/06
Posts: 1031
Loc: Whangarei New Zealand
Mike. Are you sure they were field mushrooms?

On topic. We have quite a few bees around our small block of land but the block hasn't had any pesticides for years. Possibly some support for Mike's theory.

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#21048 - 04/28/07 06:45 PM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: terrytnewzealand]
Mike Kremer Offline

Megastar

Registered: 10/16/04
Posts: 1696
Loc: London UK
Originally Posted By: terrytnewzealand
Mike. Are you sure they were field mushrooms?

Errr, I may have put in a couple from the 'Amanita' family, to spike it up a bit? Seems like something I might have done, in my younger days.
Originally Posted By: terrytnewzealand

On topic. We have quite a few bees around our small block of land but the block hasn't had any pesticides for years. Possibly some support for Mike's theory.

I think New Zealand is recognised as one of the most pesticide free countrys in the world.
Can you believe that our UK National Health Service give out small tubes of NZ honey (its only found in your country)
to use for healing leg ulcers!
Cant rem the name, but the eating variety, is twice the price in health shops here.
.
"You will never find a real Human being - even in a mirror." .....Mike Kremer.
.

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#21058 - 04/29/07 08:22 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Mike Kremer]
terrytnewzealand Offline
Megastar

Registered: 08/02/06
Posts: 1031
Loc: Whangarei New Zealand
Mike wrote:

"I think New Zealand is recognised as one of the most pesticide free countrys in the world."

That would be the promotional propaganda. We spray 'em round as much as, if not more than, any one else. Especially per head of population. The honey would be manuka (Leptospermum scoparium), also called teatree. Member of the Myrtaceae family. Supposed to have magical curing properties. Possibly may have if UK NHS gives it out. Oz teatree is genus melaleuca (spelling prob not correct but plenty of Ozzies to tell us what it should be). Same genus I think.

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#21078 - 04/30/07 04:39 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: terrytnewzealand]
Ellis Offline
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Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
The honey from the Oz teatree is marketed as healing honey and is said to contain natural antibiotics. It is readily available, and I think that the idea did originate here. Can't spell it either but something does look NQR about your effort terry!

Is the disappearance of NZ bees official.? Obviously if Oz bees are rushing to their sister's aid in the US they are still prolific here. Certainly they were around last summer.

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#21079 - 04/30/07 04:40 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees *DELETED* [Re: terrytnewzealand]
Ellis Offline
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Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Post deleted by Amaranth Rose II

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#21080 - 04/30/07 04:40 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees *DELETED* [Re: Ellis]
Ellis Offline
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Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Post deleted by Amaranth Rose II

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#21084 - 04/30/07 05:11 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Ellis]
samwik Offline
Megastar

Registered: 10/10/06
Posts: 1164
Loc: Colorado
Melaleuca alternifolia is the source of tea tree oil that I use.

~samwik
_________________________
Pyrolysis creates reduced carbon! ...Time for the next step in our evolutionary symbiosis with fire.

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#21093 - 04/30/07 09:09 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Ellis]
terrytnewzealand Offline
Megastar

Registered: 08/02/06
Posts: 1031
Loc: Whangarei New Zealand
The lowered population of honeybees here is attributed to varroa mite. Pretty well accepted. By the way, boo boo in previous post. Melaleuca (spelling off internet) is obviously not in same genus as NZ teatree. That's the genus name after all. Same family and possibly even more closely related. Oz has Leptospermums as well. Totally off the wall, here is a site dealing with them for those who have nothing better to do:

http://www.anbg.gov.au/leptospermum/index.html

I found it interesting anyway.


Edited by terrytnewzealand (04/30/07 09:14 AM)

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#21094 - 04/30/07 09:15 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: terrytnewzealand]
terrytnewzealand Offline
Megastar

Registered: 08/02/06
Posts: 1031
Loc: Whangarei New Zealand
Sorry Sam. I didn't see your post.

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#21204 - 05/03/07 01:45 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Ellis]
Amaranth Rose II Offline

Superstar

Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 962
Loc: Southeast Nebraska, USA
Here's a more recent link to the honeybee story.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070502/ap_on_sc/honeybee_die_off

It's hard to imagine a world without orange juice or cranberries.
_________________________
If you don't care for reality, just wait a while; another will be along shortly. --A Rose


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#21207 - 05/03/07 01:56 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Amaranth Rose II]
Mitthrawnuruodo Offline
Member

Registered: 04/05/07
Posts: 30
Loc: Empire State
The cranberries I can do without Rose wink. I have noticed a lack of bees this Spring and reading your article references; perhaps this is why. Just goes to show how dependent upon mother nature-even the humble bee we are. Is this a world-wide phenom?
_________________________
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Carl Sagan

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#21208 - 05/03/07 02:04 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Mitthrawnuruodo]
Amaranth Rose II Offline

Superstar

Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 962
Loc: Southeast Nebraska, USA
The article mentions several locations where this is a problem. Apparently it has not hit Australia, as we are getting replacement bees from there. How long this will hold up is anyone's guess. If it is a disease it may find a way to spread all over the world eventually.

Cranberries are good for you. I like them ground up with apples and oranges and sweetened for all they are worth. They contain loads of anti-oxidants and polyphenols. They are good for your kidneys and a good source of fiber. I don't eat them straight up, although I know some who do. To each his/her own. But if the alfalfa crop fails I know some farmers around here who are going to be awfully disappointed, and selling cows at rock-bottom prices. Maybe this year I'll be able to afford beef! smile
_________________________
If you don't care for reality, just wait a while; another will be along shortly. --A Rose


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#21214 - 05/03/07 04:33 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Amaranth Rose II]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Interesting article. Taiwan also has dying honeybees too, as have other parts of Asia. A point from the article --someone was commenting that we are too dependent on honeybees--- Einstein apparently said that wiping out the honeybee would cause the death of mankind in 3 years. In view of the arrogance of someone who can declare that we are too dependent on their pollinating our crops, I can only say we will have only ourselves to blame as I feel that overuse of chemicals may be a cause of this present situation. We have seen before that eradication of bacteria has lead to beneficial bacteria being eliminated alongside disease carrying ones.The death of honeybees could, if not stopped, lead to the death of all seeded crops, and possibly grasses too. The latter would be a disaster too terrible to imagine.

These are of course only my opinions and probably not good science, but those bees are very important and not many people seem to know that they are disappearing.

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#21223 - 05/03/07 09:06 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Ellis]
samwik Offline
Megastar

Registered: 10/10/06
Posts: 1164
Loc: Colorado
from current National Geographic Magazine.

But the largest ecological impact may have been wreaked by a much smaller, seemingly benign domestic animal: the European honeybee. In early 1622, a ship arrived in Jamestown that was a living exhibit of the Columbian exchange. It was loaded with exotic entities for the colonists to experiment with: grapevine cuttings, silkworm eggs, and beehives. Most bees pollinate only a few species; they tend to be fussy about where they live. European honeybees, promiscuous beasts, reside almost anywhere and pollinate almost anything in sight. Quickly, they swarmed from their hives and set up shop throughout the Americas.

The English imported the bees for honey, not to pollinate crops—pollination wasn't widely understood until the late 19th century—but feral honeybees pollinated farms and orchards up and down the East Coast anyway. Without them, many of the plants the Europeans brought with them wouldn't have proliferated. Georgia probably wouldn't have become the Peach State; Johnny Appleseed's trees might never have borne fruit; Huckleberry Finn might not have had any watermelons to steal. So critical to European success was the honeybee that Indians came to view it as a harbinger of invasion; the first sight of one in a new territory, noted French-American writer Jean de Crèvecoeur in 1782, "spreads sadness and consternation in all [Indian] minds."
_________________________
Pyrolysis creates reduced carbon! ...Time for the next step in our evolutionary symbiosis with fire.

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#21233 - 05/03/07 09:54 PM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Ellis]
Amaranth Rose II Offline

Superstar

Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 962
Loc: Southeast Nebraska, USA
Not to worry about grasses; they are wind pollinated. But alfalfa, buckwheat, and most fruit trees require honey bees to pollinate them.
_________________________
If you don't care for reality, just wait a while; another will be along shortly. --A Rose


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#21325 - 05/07/07 03:40 AM Re: Vanishing honeybees [Re: Amaranth Rose II]
Ellis Offline
Megastar

Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 1490
Loc: Australia
Sad news on the radio today. Our brave little bees are dying! It appears that, as feared, the little Aussie girls were not immune to the "thing" that is killing the bees in America. The latest information is that whatever it is totally wrecks the bee's immune system, and leaves it vulnerable to other infections. 90% of all crops in the US are crops that need to be pollinated by insects, primarily bees.

AR- Good news about grasses, thanks.

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