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#19042 03/17/07 07:24 PM
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Recently, i was watching on History Channel a documentary on black holes, and the possibility of there being miniscule ones on Earth. It seemed interesting, but of course "the most probable spot was the bermuda triangle". i would like to know your take on that. do you think that there would be small black holes (and similarilly, white holes and wormholes) on earth?
kinda weird, but still.

.
Tim #19051 03/17/07 09:22 PM
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My take is that the advertisers and the History Channel did very well pocketing money from gullible viewers.

There is no Bermuda Triangle.
There are no White Holes.
There are no Worm Holes (except on Star Trek).

It is all make believe like the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny.


DA Morgan
DA Morgan #19076 03/18/07 03:53 PM
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Tim

Vincent Gaddis was the author of several books about ghosts, poltergeists, intelligent fireballs, UFOs and so on. He's the one, you won't be surprised to learn, who first coined the term "The Deadly Bermuda Triangle", in a 1964 issue of Argosy, a magazine devoted to fiction. One of the people who did most to develop and popularise the legend was Charles Berlitz, who wrote a bestseller (and no doubt made a fortune) on the subject in 1974.

From Wikipedia:

"The marine insurer Lloyd's of London has determined the Triangle to be no more dangerous than any other area of ocean, and does not charge unusual rates for passage through the region. United States Coast Guard records confirm their conclusion"
_____

Re: black holes on Earth

"Fortunately, real black holes only exist in the depths of space, too far from the Earth to be of much concern. But an American physicist has put forward the idea that an experiment here on Earth regularly creates objects that bear a striking resemblance to real black holes, albeit tiny ones"

From:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/science/story/0,12996,1440631,00.html
_____

Re: white holes

"White holes cannot exist, since they violate the second law of thermodynamics"

Andrew J. S. Hamilton, University of Colorado


"Time is what prevents everything from happening at once" - John Wheeler
Tim #19223 03/21/07 11:47 PM
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The black holes in the center of galaxies are composed of condensed matter and antimatter. The black holes have the mass of a billions of suns. The oscillations between the black holes at opposite ends of the wormhole force the black holes to become white holes that eject matter and antimatter in opposite directions forming the spiral arms of stars within the galactic disk. In 1916, Karl Schwarzschild derived the first model of a black hole using Einstein's theory of general theory of relativity (the existence of white holes is implied by a negative square root solution to the Schwarzchild metric for space-time-matter continuum). Nothing, not even a particle moving at the speed of light, can escape the gravitational pull of a black hole... Small hole or not, it is NOT possible to have something as powerful and extreme as that in front of our noses and not to see it, and most of all, not to be sucked by it! And considering bermuda triangle: So there were some strange disappearances. That doesn't mean that they happend thanks to black hole, white hole, or any hole... Maybe they could be explained by electromagnetic fields, currents, or whatever, but people prefer them not to be explained becouse they like unknown astronomy phenomena, extraterrestrials and mysteries generally.

quantum #19225 03/21/07 11:56 PM
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quantum wrote:
"The black holes in the center of galaxies are composed of condensed matter and antimatter."

That is logically impossible and equally unsubstantiated by any branch of science or theory.

Where did you get this idea?


DA Morgan
quantum #19226 03/21/07 11:56 PM
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I said: Small hole or not, it is NOT possible to have something as powerful and extreme as that in front of our noses and not to see it, and most of all, not to be sucked by it!

Of course I meant
if we cannot find it - it cant suck us and if it can't suck us...well...i guess it's not there.

quantum #19227 03/21/07 11:57 PM
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quantum wrote:
"The black holes in the center of galaxies are composed of condensed matter and antimatter."

That is logically impossible and equally unsubstantiated by any branch of science or theory.

Where did you get this idea?


DA Morgan
DA Morgan #19230 03/22/07 12:08 AM
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well...i didn't made it up.
go and see for yourself:
www.matter-antimatter.com

quantum #19232 03/22/07 12:13 AM
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Now that I see where you got it I guess the logical thing to do would be to warn you away from pseudoscience.

That site is as laughable as any I've seen in awhile.

And it isn't even April 1st yet.


DA Morgan
DA Morgan #19233 03/22/07 12:15 AM
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i apologise for spreading potentially incorrect informations...

DA Morgan #19235 03/22/07 12:17 AM
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promise to be more cautious from now on crazy

quantum #19236 03/22/07 12:26 AM
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hmm... since i didn't recognize the absurdity forwarded by my own hand i guess my sleepy time is in order...

quantum #19238 03/22/07 12:31 AM
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Here's what caught my eye on the site and marked it as pseudosci.

1. "The picture of Halley's comet (center) shows solar dust particles blasting antimatter off the comet's surface."

The picture shows no such thing. Antimatter being blasted off the surface of a comet is impossible because were there any antimatter it would have instantly obliterated itself when in contact with the regular matter.

2. "The coma and tails are a plasma of matter and antimatter ions and dust particles."

Again ... mixing of matter and antimatter would be self-obliterating in femto seconds.

and it just gets worse and worse. Hope that helps.



DA Morgan
DA Morgan #19260 03/22/07 10:26 AM
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helps. thanx blush
(i could kill myself now...)
well, people make mistakes and i'm just a human...sort of

quantum #19261 03/22/07 10:29 AM
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That's very humble and magnanimous, quantum. An example to us all. Well done.


"Time is what prevents everything from happening at once" - John Wheeler
redewenur #19275 03/22/07 12:58 PM
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I'm impressed too.

But in quantum's defense, though none is needed, the site is an excellent example of pseudoscience mixing things of real value with things that have none. It is easy to see how someone might be fooled.

I have bookmarked the site so that I can use it as an example when showing how easy it is for the web to be misused.


DA Morgan
DA Morgan #19339 03/23/07 12:59 AM
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By the way, I read an article a few years back (and wish I'd kept the reference because I've mentioned to several people without the ability to point to it) about the Bermuda Triangle that I found very amusing.

A study was done showing the geographic locations of every reported maritime and aerial disappearance on record for as far back as records could be found.

If you consider the number of flights and sailings over any given area of land or sea, it turns out that the Bermuda Triangle has one of the lowest disappearance rates of any area of it's size in the world.

Perhaps it's because superstitious pilots and sailors are extra-careful there. But whatever the reason, that's a pretty hard-to-ignore debunking of a silly legend.

w

Wayne Zeller #19365 03/23/07 06:01 AM
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This is no different from the normal reaction to dreams mentioned in another thread. When people pay attention to things ... they are more likely to draw inferences.


DA Morgan

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