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A small coin found on Mars. Good, it means that there is no Communism there!

Take a look:


ES

Hey Moderator...

The local gene pool needs a chlorine shock.

Hey, Al:
Sorry to disappoint you, but that will have to be up to Kate. My contract doesn't cover things from persons with IQ's in the negative numbers. Besides, even if it's totally off the wall, it does stimulate thought and discussion, and what's a forum for? As long as neither side gets out of hand and starts making actionable statements it's no problem. In other words, play a clean game.

Out of my own experience I can offer two other logical explanations for the objects in the photograph.

One: Mars is a cold, rocky and windy place. This picture looks somewhat like frost-covered pebbles worn relatively round and smooth by long exposure to being buffetted and ground down to smoothness, on a red background that is partially covered with dark crusty material that could be lichen.

Two: The flattened, mostly circular objects could be the the fruiting or sporing bodies of something like a fungus or a slime mold. The red and the crusty-looking brownish stuff might be its base or thallus. I still think the whitish stuff is frost, or perhaps the deposition of spores from these things if they're alive, or maybe dust particles deposited by the wind.

They look way too much like the fruiting bodies of Pezizales to be unnatural, and they're way too evenly spaced.

Extrasense,

Keep looking, maybe there's some chunks of democracy lying around as well:-)

BTW, authoritative Mars pics here:

http://community.middlebury.edu/~mobrien/covers/marsattacks/index.htm

If we would found campagn posters for Bush and Kerry, we would know for sure that there is political life on Mars

By the way, the coin is 2.3 mm, so Martians must be under a foot tall.

ES

What it would actually prove is that there is no INTELLIGENT life on Mars: Nothing more!

-- it would actually prove is that there is no INTELLIGENT life on Mars --

I get that you might doubt existence of intelligent life on Earth
:rolleyes:

"Ah! The little bloke's got a point!"

I do believe he's beginning to catch on!

Beam me up, Scotty, there's no intelligent life down here."

Message from Mars just came in.

The message starts with: 5. y.

Can you read it? :roll:



ES

Nope. Two guys lying on the beach buried up to their neck in sand. The one guy has a "duckbill" nose, and he's looking from the upper left to the lower right at the other guy who is facing forward (face partially obscured). A big wave has just washed up a fish that is lying between them. The fish is dark, and its head is pointing toward the top of the frame. The caption is: "Do you think we should have started out a little further up the beach?"

You are almost correct, but it says "girls", not "guys"

Extrasense, do you have better pictures of life manifestations on Mars ?

Yes I do,
check Welcome to Mars website

e s

Thanks. I had a look on them.

Well I don't think it's possible to check any kind of microscopic fossils on these rocks actually, because of the scale factor. Whatever, laminated iron/carbonaceous is macroscopic feature and should be seen on some of your stones.

I have seen none.

kit,

sorry to say, you have totally misunderstood the pictures, since none of them is about microscopic features :rolleyes:

e :p s

How bad news. Just a question, what kind of life do you expect to find on Mars using only macroscopic pictures of the stones ?

On Earth, it tooks a long time before seeing something bigger as a match-head to appear if it's not a stromatolitic structure. Please have another look on those you have because lamination is about a few millimeters and is possible to check that from about a distance of two meters from the stone.

kit,

I find your sense of humor a lot more wanting than evidence of martian life

e s

No, not at all . I would never even try to do some humor actually in a language I don't plenty understand 20% of the subtlities.

But really, I'll love to see some early life evidences on Mars stones because of the Earth tectonic, we just have a few old rocks spared and I was wondering if these rocks were the richest fossil record at a global Earth level. IOW, perhaps we just have only the poorest things and all the best is gone forever in the crust nowadays. That's why I seek on Mars stones now. Haha, it's easier to have some pics from up there rather than some good pics from secret places on Earth. Just kidding.

kit,

To see special staff that you want to see, you have to look for yourself in the microimager pictures by MER. The best I can show you, is a picture of something that looks like stromatolite to me.



ES

Agreed. Not on the porous stone in middle of the field which shows a strange sponge-like erosion pattern, but the first in front one with sharp breccia edges seem to present folden lamination system. Very exciting picture.

This is one of the stones that must be brought back on Earth. I hope they remember where all these pics were done.

kit,

If NASA "scientists" had any brains, they would retrace the rover path now, and would checked out all the provocative things discovered on the pictures already taken.
To get again to the same area will probably take many years, when most of the issues would have been already clarified.

ES

That's not a real problem if they believe that sending people on Mars will be much better than sending expensive and sophisticated robots up there. It's just a question of a few years. Space dust should not cover it is so short time elapsed.

Human decision on a field session can't be computered. When you collect stones, you can turn upside down and choose the best specimen, releasing the bad ones. I think for fossils, the best is the human.

-- That's not a real problem if they believe that sending people on Mars will be much better than sending expensive and sophisticated robots up there. --

NASA has shown uncapable of doing any science, beyond space flight with mistakes. They probably will kill a bunch of people, and when on Mars, they will not be able to figure out a thing, because wrong astronauts were selected.

ES

There is definitely life on Mars. The over-zealous attempt to use these pictures for purposes of instant gratification hurt the cause of those interested in reality rather than fantasy.

DA,

I have discovered a lot of interesting things, while you are badmouthing whatever is being done.

You are nothing and nobody in my book. Zero.

ES

Extrasense:
As Moderator I'm going to have to ask you to refrain from making inflammatory and antagonistic remarks of this nature.

AR

Awesome :p ES, what do you mean by Nasa will not send the right person up there ? There are plenty geologist and paleontologists who are physically able to become proud astronauts for Mars investigations. Perhaps, you are telling us that they will send a confirmed mechanician+pilot+McGyver+lucky but won't be able to make the difference between a stone and a pebble.

Elaborate please.

NASA is being permanently investigated by comissions, and all reports come up with that its management is the worst possible. All the wrong decisions you can think of will be made, no doubt about it in my mind.
Nasa never was a scientific entity, never had scientists in management, and so forth.

As to the cost of sending an intelligent robot on Mars, it would be initially about $500mil per flight, probably 10 times less than sending a bunch of stupid human beings over there.

ES

Honestly, I didn't know that Nasa administration was not a scientific based corporation.

Concerning intelligent robots, I've heard the electromagnetic transmissions between the surface of Mars and Earth are too long to allows any kind of interactive driving of these robots. They will be confined to choose a stone showing superficially some predefined features. Even if it's 10 times less expensive, 20 successive robotised missions will not bring more than rubbish if there is no human decision behind to work in backplan to the choice decision level.

Concerning intelligent robots, here how it works.

Robots/rovers/ already do movement and photography autonomously.

They can preselect objects, and check with Earth what to do with them. You might be the one to make decisions.

ES

How frustrating method. What happens if the stone is too much heavy to be transported close to the departure module and cannot be shipped ?

This is only for starters, pretty soon those robots will be smarter than we are

ES, I don't question the technological point of vue but whatever "clever" are the robots, I feel that you can't really substitute a short angle camera view by a direct wide angle vision at human size to pick up one stone better than others. I can't believe machines (even human drived) able to do that as well as one geologist AND be performant at the same time.

Who knows. The only robot I have is my kitchen microwave furnace.

-- I can't believe machines --

Machines do not lie :p

ES

The first communists, I guess Lenin or something, couldn't figure out a way to work their economy without currency. So they invented tokens or something like that. In any event, these tokens looked alot like coins, etc. So communism is still a possibility.

Are not you inventing someting? May be tokens for mars subway?

Subway tokens?

ES, just curious, is there any public forum where you have not posted something concerning life on Mars ?

Let me know if you should find one

ES

Kit_kat ... any conclusions about life drawn from these pictures is ample evidence of the lack of intelligent life on earth.

Hahaha... yeeeees and no. I give a chance to hope.
I want to see some of these stones back on Earth and above any other thing, to see them be analysed with the best method, which will scan all the possibilities of non-biotic activity before stating something and spreading it to the mass.
I'm young enought, I can wait.

I want them back here too. And I have no doubt that life does exist on Mars and on other planets and/or moons.

That said ... someone foisting fabricated evidence for life such as these pictures only aids those that are anti-science.

Your claim of "fabricated evidence" is really a criminal libel. And it shows how low has parasitic pseudoscience sunk.

ES

ES, I think Damorgan have the good philosophy of this affair because some people are currently really speculating on some results that are impossible to check without a rigourous scientific methodology. Bless my incompetance in using the correct english words but I think this tantalizing is just alike man-made religious divine proofs of a diety existance. How bad.

Why don't you sit down on your stool and wait for these stones to come back ? There are plenty things to do seeking for Early life on Earth.
Have no stones in your garden ?

You said you are young. What makes you follow the stinky parasites? Why not open your eyes?
Because they will rob you of your ideas and discoveries as well, in order to keep the money flowing.

:p

Kit Kat's eyes are wide open. Open to the fact that you have an agenda and that you have no interest in letting reason or scientific proof interfere with it.

There are other words that also describe your behaviour. Words like "fanatic", "crackpot", and "troll".

--- There are other words that also describe your behaviour. Words like "fanatic", "crackpot", and "troll". ---

I present you with statues, skulls, and flowers from Mars. You can come up with nothing but name calling. Now, who behaves like "fanatic" and "crackpot"?

ES

The thing are coming together.
A snake ribbon on the surface of Mars, photographed by Opprtunity navcam, after the leach ribbon was discovered by its microimager!






Some are going to eat their hats soon


es

ES, you never give up ? I agree that someone will have to eat his own hat but he won't be the one of your expectance.

On the top picture, this is almost certainly a differential erosion of the rocks giving a snake track appearence. The lowest pic shows absolutely nothing. People from this forum allready told you that if there is life manifestation on Mars (in which I'll be very glad to learn) it will not be more elaborated than microscopic organisms. Spirit and opportunity webcams can't send close-edged pictures and won't technically be able to give more information at the microscopic level.

Have you followed the studies of the martian meteorites found on Earth ?

Why not you be not so cheap, and buy 3D glasses?
This would help

e s

That's not fair ES and rather unpleasant joke. I have a soft strabysm and 3D stuff don't work on my own brain. You couldn't know.

So ask someone who does not, who you trust, and who can use 3D glasses

es

In case you are not aware of it the University of Washington, where I teach, has an astronomy department and some of the professors and grad students specialize in planetary studies.

I can safely speak for them and myself when I say that we would like nothing more than clear cut proof of life on Mars: Either fossilized or running around poking at a rover.

Your trash isn't that proof and you should be ashamed of yourself for pushing a hallucination as a physical object.

This is the thing about pseudoscience parasites:
they pretend to be the guardians of science

es

Yes, you do.

This is either the biggest troll session I've seen outside of /. or Extrasenseless actually believes this junk.


ES: Get off the rag, and inject a neuron or two into that void between your ears.

Wow, someone disagree

As Moderator, I have this to say:

This is a Science Discussion forum, not a flaming sandbox. We don't discuss politics and we don't proselytize. Nor do we need to exchange insults. Your comment is inappropriate. I request that you either amend your post or prepare to be censored again.

Lose it or change it. Choose.

NASA O'Keefe to resign!

Hopefully, the new boss will kick the NASA science team morons out, and we will smell fowers !!!!!!

But, he is going to become University Pres!
Pseudoscience concervation law to be confirmed

http://www.bradenton.com/mld/bradenton/news/politics/10396016.htm

es