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Just another miracle don't you know.

Anything can be explained by just claiming it is a miracle.

Why didn't the T Rex eat the sheep?
Why didn't the Tuberculosis infect the humans?
Why didn't the cats eat the birds?
What did they do with all that dung?
How did hippos get to Turkey?
Or Canadian polar bears?

Just another miracle.

Well with the polar bears we know it was air-conditioned 747s but the rest ... all miracles.


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If we give the source every benefit of the doubt and consider how could we duplicate the Noah trip we would not collect actual animals we would find a "all-purpose-womb" and take the DNA of all the animals we wanted to clone and reproduce them later. Any way careful reading will show Noah did not take two of everything.

I have always wondered about the mountains 15 cubits high covered with water. Where did all that water go? Things are not always what they seem. Does it matter if the story is true or even intended to be accurate?
jjw

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during the time of noah, no one had any clue about dna existance, let alone cloning. A carefull reading of that indicated that he had to have, because there was no way for the diverstity of the animal kingdom without it. he would have had to take every subspecies as well.


the more man learns, the more he realises, he really does not know anything.
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Quote:
Originally posted by jjw:
Any way careful reading will show Noah did not take two of everything.
No, he took two of each "kind." The definition of kind varies, depending on the point the creation ~scientist~ is attempting to make.

Also, he took SEVEN of each clean animal. I don't know what that means, but I'd guess the un-Kosher ones didn't make the grade.


When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross."
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Stories grow. I'd presume the stories of Gilgamesh and Noah etc. are oral memories of the same event. Almost certainly a flood on the Mesopotamian plain. A farmer may have collected his family, a couple of his goats and a donkey and floated until he reached higher ground. Legend and archaeology suggest this was Eridu. They caught fish to survive for a few days and everyone knows about fishermen.

Any explanation invoking modern scientific knowledge to explain how some ancient farmer managed to rescue every living thing from a worldwide flood involves putting the cart before the horse.

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Did all these guys go on a creationst golf retreat together?

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DA Morgan. You suggested history has been going "Roughly 8,000 years". I pretty sure the definition of history is that it is based on writing. Writing didn't really begin until about 6000 years ago and was at that time mostly chartered accountancy type writing. Anything remotely resembling sources that can be used for history don't exist until about 2000 years after that, about 2000 BC. Of course writing didn't reach some cultures until 200 years ago. Oral tradition in those regions does preserve relatively recent events and these stories can be treated as history but stories older than about 200 years become totally garbled and unreliable.

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The definition of "writing" is a bit subject to definition. In a pictographic world, one you should be familiar with, given the indigenous Maori population, cave paintings are a form of writing.

I think there is room for reasonable people to debate what they choose as that point in time. I don't have strong feelings one way or the other.


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Quote:
Originally posted by terrytnewzealand:
Oral tradition in those regions does preserve relatively recent events and these stories can be treated as history but stories older than about 200 years become totally garbled and unreliable.
Hiya Terry,

Do you have any examples, or a reliable source for this? Cheers.

Blacknad.

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Blacknad. I haven't read anything on the subject lately but years ago research on New Zealand Maori traditions relating to memories of European visits and events known from archaeology showed that 200 years was maximum for reliable recollection. That's about six generations. I'll try to find some recent research.

DA. I was merely pointing out that if Gilgamesh's flood occurred even 4000 BC the earliest written record of it dates to probably 2000 years later. I agree carvings and cave paintings provide some record of historical events but groups of people tend to get pushed around over time. Often people living in a region have no idea about the origin or meaning of such records.

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sorry Blacknad, I?m running out of time. The only one I?ve found yet is Wikipedia entry on "historical method".

?Elsewhere, Garraghan suggests a maximum limit of 150 years, at least in cultures that excel in oral remembrance?. From a book ?A Guide to Hitorical Method? evidently.

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Cheers Terry.

Blacknad.

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