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#36836 - 12/13/10 10:56 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Bill S.]
preearth Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/10
Posts: 370
Originally Posted By: Bill S.
Quote:
Olinto De Pretto published e=mc2 a few years before Einstein.

Which has what to do with the veracity, or otherwise, of the moon landings?

Nothing, actually. It is just a comment on magiimice's tag line.
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#37195 - 01/23/11 01:20 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: preearth]
preearth Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/10
Posts: 370
Once upon a time this was a very popular thread.

What Happened?
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#37200 - 01/23/11 02:04 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: preearth]
Bill S. Offline
Megastar

Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 3570
Loc: Essex, UK
Quote:
Once upon a time this was a very popular thread.
What Happened?


Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that people tend not to answer questions!

How about:"does anyone think that if the Americans had not really landed on the moon, the Russians would have failed to notice that fact?"
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#37511 - 02/23/11 08:24 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Bill S.]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
I doubt that Apollo 11 was real and I know that Apollo 12 was fake.

http://www.nasa.gov/topics/moonmars/features/magnetotail_080416.html

added to this...

http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/phase/phases-1999.html

together with this...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_landing#Manned_Moon_landings

Connect the dots. The astronauts of Apollo 12 would have been electrocuted. Apollo 11 cut if awfully close. Too close.

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#37516 - 02/23/11 11:29 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
I'll go ahead and spell it out. One of the three can't be true...

http://www.nasa.gov/topics/moonmars/features/magnetotail_080416.html
NASA
"Apollo astronauts never landed on a full moon and they never experienced the magnetotail."

http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/phase/phases-1999.html
NASA
Full Moon
Nov 19 1969 14:45

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_landing#Manned_Moon_landings
WIKI
Apollo 12 Lunar Landing date
Nov 19 1969

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#37521 - 02/24/11 07:48 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
One of these can't be true:

1) A 2nd hand, partial qoute from "Tim Stubbs, a University of Maryland scientist working at the Goddard Space Flight Center."

2) Apollo 12 landed on a full moon.

Hmm. Tough choice!!! We know those reporters always perfectly represent what their sources tell them. And we know those Maryland scientists always utter perfect truths.


But that avoids the more important point which is:

"On the moon’s dayside this effect is counteracted to a degree by sunlight: UV photons knock electrons back off the surface, keeping the build-up of charge at relatively low levels."

And Apollo 12 landed on the dayside according to Wikipedia.

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#37524 - 02/24/11 08:49 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: kallog]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
So you would choose #2...Apollo 12 landed on a full moon, they did experience the magnetotail, and enjoyed watching the...

"two million degree electrons in the plasma sheet race around like crazy and many of them hit the moon's surface. Solar wind electrons are relatively cool at only 140 thousand degrees, and fewer of them zip all the way down to the shadowed surface of the moon's nightside."

Interesting choice. I wonder why the astronauts didn't mention it?

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#37528 - 02/24/11 04:37 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
Originally Posted By: Max
"two million degree electrons in the plasma sheet race around like crazy and many of them hit the moon's surface. Solar wind electrons are relatively cool at only 140 thousand degrees, and fewer of them zip all the way down to the shadowed surface of the moon's nightside."


Sounds like fun. But do you know what that would look or feel like?

Keep in mind that existing solar wind that everybody's known about for ages has "only" 140,000 degree electrons.

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#37533 - 02/24/11 06:21 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: kallog]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
hehe, I was just being stupid like you were. When I read your first reply, I thought, "Sounds just like an agw alarmist. Ignore the facts and attack the source." Apollo 11 was obviously faked and now we're seeing that Apollo 12 was also faked. In fact, NASA has been nothing more than a delivery boy shuttle service to your nearest orbit. smile

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#37543 - 02/25/11 03:57 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
Attack the source? Sure. There's a clear contradiction in the information on the site you posted, and Wikipedia. One of the sources must be wrong!

Anyway. Why do you think Apollo 11 or 12 was faked? Can you show any evidence that hasn't already been discredited? This "two million degree electrons" thing isn't evidence until you can show that such conditions would actually be noticed by astronauts.

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#37549 - 02/25/11 06:28 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: kallog]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
The info I posted came from NASA. It is published on a NASA server. There is no need to debate what happens when the magnetotail lashes the moon. Mostly everything in the article is speculation. The salient points are...

"No one can say for sure what happens on the moon when the magnetotail hits, because no one has been there at the crucial time."

"Apollo astronauts never landed on a full moon and they never experienced the magnetotail."

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#37551 - 02/25/11 03:07 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
Originally Posted By: Max

"Apollo astronauts never landed on a full moon and they never experienced the magnetotail."

Yea, that's the clear contradiction I was talking about. Wikipedia says Apollo 12 landed on a full moon.

How do those words show the Apollo 12 landing was faked? It's just the words of one person quoting another person. It's not gospel.

I suspect the scientist being interviewed was talking about the night side of the moon, where Apollo 12 did not land. The reporter may have confused that with the whole moon.

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#37555 - 02/25/11 06:02 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
Bill S. Offline
Megastar

Registered: 08/20/10
Posts: 3570
Loc: Essex, UK
Oh, well, perhaps the Russians just weren't watching!
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There never was nothing.

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#37558 - 02/25/11 06:50 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Bill S.]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
There is a lot of info on the magnetotail out there. I would suggest that you read some of it before you comment about astronauts being anywhere on the moon when passing through the magnetotail.

Wiki is just quoting the dates. No proof of anything. lol!

"I suspect the scientist being interviewed was talking about the night side of the moon, where Apollo 12 did not land. The reporter may have confused that with the whole moon."

No. "and they never experienced the magnetotail." You need to read the whole sentence and keep things in context.

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#37572 - 02/26/11 10:28 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
Originally Posted By: Max
"and they never experienced the magnetotail." You need to read the whole sentence and keep things in context.


I can see that quite clearly. That's why I keep saying it's contradictory. Can you explain how this contradiction shows the Apollo 12 moon landing was faked?

Did the person writing the article know it was faked and accidentally revealed that information which he should have kept secret? What is your reasoning?


The location on the moon is important because that site says the effects would be stronger on the night side. All the flying dust and electric zaps were supposed to happen on the night-side, not the day-side where Apollo 12 landed.

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#37578 - 02/26/11 05:06 PM Re: fake moon landing [Re: kallog]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
Originally Posted By: kallog
All the flying dust and electric zaps were supposed to happen on the night-side, not the day-side where Apollo 12 landed.


You misread the article. There is a lot of info out there. Read it. Don't rely on one article. NASA knows they haven't sent a manned mission to the moon when it was in the magnetotail.

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#37586 - 02/27/11 04:15 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
Originally Posted By: Max
You misread the article. There is a lot of info out there. Read it. Don't rely on one article.


So your argument now depends on "a lot of info out there"? That means your original post about connecting the dots of the three websites was meaningless and didn't show anything.

Can you spell out your complete chain of reasoning, without deferring to an undefined body of information that makes unspecified claims?

What exactly is supposed to happen to astronauts on the day side of the moon in the magnetotail? Really what? Should they be vaporised? Should they be electrocuted? Should their spacesuits be damaged? Should they notice electric sparks? Should their vision be obstructed by dust? This seems to be quite crucial to your argument but you haven't stated it yet.

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#37596 - 02/27/11 08:49 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: kallog]
Max Offline
Member

Registered: 02/18/07
Posts: 93
Read the original article if you want speculation of what the astronauts would expect to experience. It's all there for you. I could quote it for you but you seemed to have missed it the first time, why would you read it now? There are a lot of websites where you could read and form a valid opinion if you were interested. I'm not going to pick websites for you. You have already shown that you will only insult the scientists and take things out of context and I'm too old for those kind of childish games. I prefer a more constructive debate rather than the alarmist method. I apologize that you were unable to connect the dots, but I did spell it out for you in the next post. wink

There are other NASA websites that say the same thing...

"Apollo astronauts never landed on a full moon and they never experienced the magnetotail."

And this...

"No one can say for sure what happens on the moon when the magnetotail hits, because no one has been there at the crucial time."

I'm flattered that you value my opinion, and I apologize that I can't offer anymore than what the NASA scientists and others have told us. Again...

"No one can say for sure what happens on the moon when the magnetotail hits, because no one has been there at the crucial time."

"Apollo astronauts never landed on a full moon and they never experienced the magnetotail."

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#37597 - 02/27/11 10:37 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: Max]
kallog Offline
Megastar

Registered: 03/17/10
Posts: 1100
Originally Posted By: Max
Read the original article if you want speculation of what the astronauts would expect to experience. It's all there for you.


It really is not there. This is what's there instead:

"On the moon’s dayside this effect is counteracted to a degree by sunlight: UV photons knock electrons back off the surface, keeping the build-up of charge at relatively low levels. But on the nightside, in the cold lunar dark, electrons accumulate and surface voltages can climb to hundreds or thousands of volts.
Imagine what it feels like to be a sock pulled crackling from a dryer. Astronauts on the moon [no mention of dayside or nightside, but the context implies nightside] during a magnetotail crossing might be able to tell you. Walking across ...
The ground, meanwhile, might leap into the sky.... and generally make life difficult for astronauts.
Stranger still, moondust might gather itself into a sort of diaphanous wind. ... strongest at the moon’s terminator, the dividing line between day and night."


So you can see it certainly does not speculate that any of these effects would appear on the dayside, which is where the Apollo 12 astronauts were.


Do you still think I missed it? I ask you again to show how it says the dayside would have these effects. Alternatively, apologize for telling me I hadn't read it properly.


Quote:
for those kind of childish games

Please don't use insults.


Quote:

"Apollo astronauts never landed on a full moon and they never experienced the magnetotail."

It's an exact quote from the same person. So it could easily perpetuate the same mistake. When you're trying to think critically you can't blindly trust the words of any one person.

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#37598 - 02/27/11 11:39 AM Re: fake moon landing [Re: kallog]
preearth Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/10
Posts: 370

Was the moon-landing faked? Join the action at;

Replacement for shuttle. Why not the Saturn V?
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Earth formed from a collision
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Plate-tectonics is wrong
www.preearth.net/plate.html

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