Science a GoGo's Home Page Forums General Discussion General Science Discussion Forum How to manufacture crackpots and confusion

Couldn't agree more. The joke for years has been that Cheney is Bush's insurance policy.

The reason why you are seeing the games around the war here is that those most likely to end it must face two political realities. The first is that the American public will only put them into office if they appear tough ... alpha-male like.

Here's an interesting study in human behavior. All of those currently in power and making war-and-peace decisions have NEVER served in the military and NEVER been in combat.

Many of those most strongly opposed to the war are those who have served, have REAL combat experience, and know of what they speak.

Note with how much zeal the chicken-hawks tore into Senator Kerry who is a decorated combat veteran. Note how they treat Congressman Murtha and Senator Hagel. It is not all that different from watching some here at SAGG argue that professional climatologists don't understand climatology as well as they do. Those who are weakest ... often scream the loudest trying to imitate the alpha of old (picture a male gorilla pounding his chest).

So to become President, aka Commander-in-Chief of the military one must, in a sense, be dishonest.

The second issue is partially that we have become a kleptocracy but also the reality that it is a lot easier to start a fight than it is to end one.

I can't think of anyone I know with an IQ over room temperature that doesn't thinks going into Iraq in the first place was a bad idea created by a climate of lying to the public and the world.

At the same time I can't think of anyone that doesn't believe that when we leave, no matter when or how, there won't be a blood bath, abuse of women's rights, and horrors reminiscent of Darfur or Stalin's purges.

So comments among those wanting to exit often are one of these:
* We never should have gotten in and created this mess but we will only make it worse by staying one day longer.

* We never should have gotten in and created this mess but we owe to those we've hurt to try to make it better before we leave.

* We never should have gotten in and created this mess but the mess was created by bad execution and bad policy and good execution and good policy will make things right.

In my opinion ... it just isn't that simple.

We made a huge mess and it will take multiple generations of good policies and good behavior to fix it. Something America is very poor at: Patience.

I think what we should do is publicly apologize for what we did in Iraq, publicly apologize for what we did overthrowing Mohammed Mosadek (back in the 50s), publicly apologize for interfering in other country's affairs.

And then realistically take stock of what it took for Europe to overcome its idiotic behaviors (WWI and WWII) and the fact that little short of a similar trauma is going to solve the problems in the Moslem world.